1st day after triplets - All the Questions

That family photo is amazing. Your doe looks very pleased with herself and what colorful babies! Congratulations on your kidding! It sounds like you did great. Let me try to address some of your questions, and I'm sure others will chime in too.

• If the placenta is hanging out and wrapped around a leg etc. Can you trim it or should you literally just leave it be. Don't touch it. It'll be okay. The doe moving around and the contractions of the uterus caused by the kids starting to nurse will help her pass it. I've never seen one that needed assistance once the doe started passing it.
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• Anything else I should do for the scours at this point or just continue monitoring? Is it actual scouring or just atypical poops that look like a dog's poop or a log of semi-formed berries? It is EXTREMELY typical for some does to have atypical poops after kidding, sometimes even for up to a week. The change in diet with lots of added grain can also cause this. Unless it is actual watery scour, I would not be concerned. Monitor her rectal temperature to ensure that it's normal and keep making sure she's eating and drinking. Vaginal discharge is totally normal but please make sure it's not discolored or malodorous.
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• As for the kids, it's so hard to know if they are getting enough. We are concerned that this doe may not produce enough milk to support triplets, especially once they start to grow and need more with each meal. Should we be making the executive decision to switch one to a bottle now? Can we try to "cross train" one on a bottle once they are off colostrum so they are willing to take it either way? Weigh them. It's the only way to know. At this age, if you're concerned she may not be making enough milk, watch them to make sure all three are feeding frequently and weigh them several times a day. If they're not gaining good ground or you see a loss, you can indeed pull one to exclusively bottle feed or you can supplement one or all three with bottles or a lambbar. Buy a hanging fish scale with gram weights and a lamb sling for ease of weighing - Tractor Supply and farm supply stores will usually be able to supply what you need. You can also just put the babies in a tote bag at this age and hang it from the fish scale.
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• We have read that bucks need to be separated around 10 weeks due to risks of them maturing sexually, which seems pretty early to be weaning off of milk. Would bottle feeding the buck make the most sense then so we can continue to give milk after separating? Depends on what you're doing with the buck. You can wether him at any point and then obviously he can stay on the dam until he is sold or she weans him. If he is to be sold for breeding, or if you prefer to wait longer to wether him for urinary health, he can stay on the dam longer if you utilize a buck apron. We get ours from Bacchus Johnson Aprons. Either way, 10 weeks will be fine to get him off milk if you must separate him at that point. Most people will wean between 8-12 weeks.
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• Our other doe is likely going to pop imminently but we arent sure what to do with the birthing area. We feel that the first doe needs to stay in there for now but aren't sure it's a good idea to bring the other doe into the same area to deliver. We are actively working on a way to partition the box stall but just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this. My opinion is don't bring another doe into the postpartum area with these guys still in there. There may be conflicts and anxiety. Best bet is to contrive a partition - perhaps you can grab some pallets to achieve this. We keep pallets on hand if we need to create temporary multiple stalls in our big winter kidding pen. But if the kids are sufficiently mobile, you can really put them back with the herd anytime. We put our dams and kids back with the herd when they're 2-5 days old as long as everyone is up and around. Once the babies are dry they are extremely cold hardy and they will enjoy starting to learn to run and jump.

Also, no need to offer baking soda free choice - it can impede the rumen from producing its own buffer. Offer baking soda only if you see signs of bloat or the goat got into something that could cause rumen dysfunction.

I hope some of that helps! I'm sure some of our much more knowledgable folks will chime in also.

wheel-bear-o said:

That family photo is amazing. Your doe looks very pleased with herself and what colorful babies! Congratulations on your kidding! It sounds like you did great. Let me try to address some of your questions, and I'm sure others will chime in too.

• If the placenta is hanging out and wrapped around a leg etc. Can you trim it or should you literally just leave it be. Don't touch it. It'll be okay. The doe moving around and the contractions of the uterus caused by the kids starting to nurse will help her pass it. I've never seen one that needed assistance once the doe started passing it.
• 
  
• Anything else I should do for the scours at this point or just continue monitoring? Is it actual scouring or just atypical poops that look like a dog's poop or a log of semi-formed berries? It is EXTREMELY typical for some does to have atypical poops after kidding, sometimes even for up to a week. The change in diet with lots of added grain can also cause this. Unless it is actual watery scour, I would not be concerned. Monitor her rectal temperature to ensure that it's normal and keep making sure she's eating and drinking. Vaginal discharge is totally normal but please make sure it's not discolored or malodorous.
• 
  
• As for the kids, it's so hard to know if they are getting enough. We are concerned that this doe may not produce enough milk to support triplets, especially once they start to grow and need more with each meal. Should we be making the executive decision to switch one to a bottle now? Can we try to "cross train" one on a bottle once they are off colostrum so they are willing to take it either way? Weigh them. It's the only way to know. At this age, if you're concerned she may not be making enough milk, watch them to make sure all three are feeding frequently and weigh them several times a day. If they're not gaining good ground or you see a loss, you can indeed pull one to exclusively bottle feed or you can supplement one or all three with bottles or a lambbar. Buy a hanging fish scale with gram weights and a lamb sling for ease of weighing - Tractor Supply and farm supply stores will usually be able to supply what you need. You can also just put the babies in a tote bag at this age and hang it from the fish scale.
• 
  
• We have read that bucks need to be separated around 10 weeks due to risks of them maturing sexually, which seems pretty early to be weaning off of milk. Would bottle feeding the buck make the most sense then so we can continue to give milk after separating? Depends on what you're doing with the buck. You can wether him at any point and then obviously he can stay on the dam until he is sold or she weans him. If he is to be sold for breeding, or if you prefer to wait longer to wether him for urinary health, he can stay on the dam longer if you utilize a buck apron. We get ours from Bacchus Johnson Aprons. Either way, 10 weeks will be fine to get him off milk if you must separate him at that point. Most people will wean between 8-12 weeks.
• 
  
• Our other doe is likely going to pop imminently but we arent sure what to do with the birthing area. We feel that the first doe needs to stay in there for now but aren't sure it's a good idea to bring the other doe into the same area to deliver. We are actively working on a way to partition the box stall but just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this. My opinion is don't bring another doe into the postpartum area with these guys still in there. There may be conflicts and anxiety. Best bet is to contrive a partition - perhaps you can grab some pallets to achieve this. We keep pallets on hand if we need to create temporary multiple stalls in our big winter kidding pen. But if the kids are sufficiently mobile, you can really put them back with the herd anytime. We put our dams and kids back with the herd when they're 2-5 days old as long as everyone is up and around. Once the babies are dry they are extremely cold hardy and they will enjoy starting to learn to run and jump.

Also, no need to offer baking soda free choice - it can impede the rumen from producing its own buffer. Offer baking soda only if you see signs of bloat or the goat got into something that could cause rumen dysfunction.

I hope some of that helps! I'm sure some of our much more knowledgable folks will chime in also.

Click to expand...

Thank you so incredibly much for taking the time to reply. Her poops are definitely watery such that if someone tracks through it after it will get everywhere, but the whole dog's poop comparison also seems relatively accurate as well. I've been covering them with straw for now and I think we are going to pitchfork some of the soiled straw out pretty soon. All your points are very well taken, I especially appreciated the part about cold hardiness. With any luck there will be a few more days before doe #2 pops and we won't have to worry about the partitioning. Also somehow totally overlooked the fact that we would probably be whethering him and so he could stay on a milk diet for longer than 10 weeks anyhow. I think the current plan is to keep the whether as a companion for our other whether when the buck is busy doing his buck-ly duties.

Hey y'all, well, the scours are getting much better on the first doe. Unfortunately she began to shun her triplet, which might be a goat-instinct way of saying she doesn't have enough milk (especially once they are a bit bigger). We made the decision to make her a bottle baby and have been feeding her by hand since last night (she hasn't taken to the bottle yet so it's a mix of trying the bottle and then switching to a syringe). The mom has been quite unkind to her, for instance getting up and walking away the instant she comes to lay down beside her, and even pushing her away forcefully with her head. It's quite ovious if you spend even 5-10 min with them that the mom is doting on the 2 and completely ignoring the 3rd. We're not sure if the triplet's safety would be at risk or not but we don't have a ton of other options right now so will have to just keep monitoring for any signs that it is unsafe for her with them. The weighing tip from @wheel-bear-o has been fantastic. Really nice to see a steady climb in weight, as well as draw comparisons with the other two who are not being neglected at all.

Also, yesterday, one of our other does who we believed was up to a month behind in pregnancy had a MASSIVE single goat that took us off guard completely. He is HUGE! And by the time we got to him the mom had him dried off and he was already nursing. 💕

Had to share a pic because he is absolutely gorgeous and I'm completely obcessed, lol.

Just an update on our shunned triplet. We experimented with putting her in the other enclosure with the doe who had 1. Things seemed to be going well, the other mother was sniffing but not headbutting anytime she encountered her. I was very surprised that our extremely well tempered whether who is also in that enclosure was also showing aggression toward her. Normally the only time he headbutts anything is the buck he grew up with at feeding time and, given his small size it hasn't really been an issue.

Toward the end of the day we tried to ensure she was going to make it into the shelter for sleeping and the momma doe pinned her up against a corner repeatedly. We both witnessed this and had no question in our mind that this wasn't going to work. As far as I saw the kid did nothing to provoke that, e.g. she wasn't trying to suckle or anything. Even though we have cameras in the shelter to keep an eye on things we just aren't able to respond quickly enough in a situation like that.
...........So we caved and brought her in the house. We've done this once before with a bottle baby with varying levels of success, specifically going to sleep at night in a kennel has been a lot of screaming to settle down. Last night little Sage fussed for less than a minute before settling in and not a peep from her all night and even in the morning when I was up and about. She woke up, for sure, but wasn't protesting at all. After feeding, we had to go outside so I put her back in the kennel and this time expected her to fuss. Again, not a peep. I am debating bringing her out to hang out with me (I WFH so am at my desk a lot, so I could easily have a lap guest).

Also, we've thankfully got her taking the bottle now and have been feeding whole milk 4 times a day. This morning she drank 3oz and emptied the bottle, I was so happy. We are keeping tabs on her weight thanks to the excellent advice in this thread and are seeing continuous increases day by day.

Right now, the plan is that when it's warm enough the goats all hang out outside and there are lots of places for her to run to and hide (pictured below, she fits inside a tire we have setup in the pen 😭), we will put her out so she gets some socializing in, but at night we are feeling pretty strongly that she is going to be much safer in the house with us. She's also made such an impact on us that we are pretty much decided on keeping her instead of selling her. One idea that has come up is that once the other kids are less dependent on their mothers, we could put just the kids together in a pen for an hour or two at a time so they can get to know one another without the parents getting involved.
Thoughts on this plan overall? Is she likely going to be bullied by her mom for her whole life now or will it ease once she grows up some? That is the one thing we arent sure about. I know its impossible to know but just looking for any experiences or thoughts or general comiseration you all might have lol.

Thanks again for taking the time to read.

CountyLineAcres said:

Exciting that you want to keep her!

In order for us to not isolate the bottle kids, we have a creep area set up in a large maternity area (where all the moms and babies are) so the kiddos can escape from the adults. This way, the bottle babies have the freedom to hang out with their siblings and be a goat. Plus, they have a safe area they can sleep and eat in without being targeted by a protective doe.

If that’s something you’re interested in, I can explain further on how I make a creep area. If not, having play time like you mentioned is a good idea too.

Click to expand...

Ahh perfect, thank you so much for this. As soon as I said the word "creep area" my partner had an epiphany since apparently this is a thing with horses as well. (I have no clue, I'm from the city until 2020 lol). I think we have the perfect spot to build one and are planning to have it ready for the big reunion that will probably happen tomorrow or Saturday as the weather forecast is looking great.

Our 3rd doe finally delivered 2 babies yesterday and gave us our biggest test yet as the 2nd presented originally as the bubble / liquid part of the amniotic sack, then a foot, and turns out he was in breech with only 1 rear hoof sticking out Fortunately we got him out with a bit of work and mama and kids seem to be doing well this morning. The total tally for this year is 6 kids, with 2 does and 4 bucks. Haha, not the best ratio there but we love them all the same, especially our shunned triplet who has been making appearances in video meetings all morning lol.

Hi all, just an update. We put in the creep area and brought everyone- including the bottle baby who has been in the house- together again. So far, the results have been quite surprising!
Doe #3 who had twins has shown borderline affection for the bottle baby, and allowed her to nurse more than once. And it was on her own- not like she snuck in while another kid was feeding, so she was absolutely aware what was happening. Not sure if it matters but the bottle baby looks similar to her 2nd kid.
Should we allow this to continue? The one concern is that it might deplete the doe of milk needed for her other kids.

The plan was to leave the bottle baby out during the day and bring her in the house at night to avoid any sleeping shelter drama. We were also not expecting her to nurse at all and give she now eagerly takes the bottle we had planned on continuing to bottle feed 4x daily but I dont want to risk overfeeding. We can probably use weight and pee volume to judge a little but open to suggestions here.

Thanks as always!!