2 does gave birth at once and I missed it- help!

Discussion in 'Kidding Koral' started by fruittartcaprines, Jan 16, 2011.

  1. fruittartcaprines

    fruittartcaprines New Member

    145
    Mar 3, 2010
    Twins with pineapple are up and nursing fine. Rende had triplets, two dead when I got to the barn and one is alive but doesn't seem very vigorous. Rende doesn't seem to be paying anyattention to him. He has tried to nurse with my help but can't seem to find the teat. Not sure if I should interfere besides warming him up or not. Gave him some nutridrench.
     
  2. liz

    liz Well-Known Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    Get him warm and totally dry. Take his temp..if over 100* then get him on the teat, if not then you'll need to get his temp up , putting him in a bag with his head out, submerse him in a tub of very warm water til his temp comes up, then either give him colostrum with a syringe or allow him to get it from mom.
     

  3. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    Yep, agree with Liz. You can also give a mix of Molasses or karo, black strong coffee and Whiskey(or any other hard liquor) in three equal parts. Give a couple cc's to the kid to get his temp up.

    If you have a weak kid syringe you may need to tube feed him.
     
  4. fruittartcaprines

    fruittartcaprines New Member

    145
    Mar 3, 2010
    Got a tiny bit of colustrum in him. He's plenty warm, just sleepy. Mom is not interested at all. Not sure if she thinks all the kids died or whether it's because the previous owner took her other kids and bottle raised them? She has passed the placentas and is just eating hay like nothing happened. I was able to milk her to get some colostrum just fine but she doesn't seem to want him to nurse. Any ideas? He's sleeping now but has been on his feet a couple of times.
     
  5. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    he needs a couple ounces of colostrum -- I would syringe feed or tube feed him if he cant suck yet. Offer him a bottle to at least get him going and then you can introduce him back to mom and keep encouraging her to let him nurse (You may need to tie her up)
     
  6. jduwall

    jduwall New Member

    565
    Aug 7, 2009
    Good luck. My prayers are with you
     
  7. fruittartcaprines

    fruittartcaprines New Member

    145
    Mar 3, 2010
    Got 2 1/2 oz in him but had to bring him into the house to do it. Will try to reintroduce in a little bit but I'm not feeling hopeful. What are the chances she'll take him? She ignored him completely and didn't even whine when we brought him up to the house.
     
  8. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Probably not real likely but I always suggest it because some does will accept later on.
     
  9. sweetgoats

    sweetgoats Moderator

    Oct 18, 2007
    Peyton CO.
    I would tie mom up and hold her leg if she is kicking at him. The more you can get him to drink HER milk the better chance you have. We have had to bring in one baby at night and mom did not care (soulds like yours) but she did take the baby backm. Have you put baby up to momks face and try to get to clean him? Good luck
     
  10. fruittartcaprines

    fruittartcaprines New Member

    145
    Mar 3, 2010
    Tried to hobble her and she wants none of it! She won't sniff or lick him at all, it's literally like he doesn't exist. I'm wondering if it's because she was on a farm that did CAE prevention and she's birthed twice before so she is used to them being taken away. She doesn't call back even when he is squealing. Will try again in a bit but am starting to resign myself to raising a bottle baby. Not a big deal really, just a little unexpected.
     
  11. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    Keep doing it ...don't give up.....it will take a while...maybe even... 1 week or so....but ....she sounds like.... she doesn't know what to do.... because of the CAE prevention....and is acting like a first timer....

    Also.... make sure ...they both are in a small type stall alone.... no other goats or kids...to interfere.... in them bonding..... this is crucial ...even if ...you have to work....with the momma and baby..... by tying her...every couple of hours or so.... ..eventually... you will get to the point ...that she may not have to have her leg tied..... reward.... if she does good...no rewards... if she doesn't cooperate.... she hasn't bonded with him at all.... that is why... she isn't calling out to him....

    Also... I recommend giving a shot of Bo-se.....
     
  12. fruittartcaprines

    fruittartcaprines New Member

    145
    Mar 3, 2010
    Well as of this am she still doesn't want anything to do with him. I've tried hobbling her and tying her up most of the night (obviously on and off, the poor thing) but she really is just not interested in him at all. And he showed no interest in nursing - he won't poke at her though he pokes at my neck and chin like a madman when I pick him up. (I do, of course, feed him when he does).

    She won't clean him though she sniffed him once or twice.

    She has a bit of retained placenta (she had passed two, the third I didn't see until this morning) and I'm hopeful that she'll get it out before the end of the day (that will be the 24 hours) but I'm going to call the vet just in case. I'm thinking of starting her on Penicillin regardless, she just doesn't look quite right to me. She's eating, but not as piggishly as normal (normally she's a big pig) and drinking, pooping and peeing, but she just looks "off" to me and she's not bellowing like she normally would.

    Baby is eating, but only about an ounce at a time, just more frequently. He's pooping okay and peeing okay, so I guess this is working for him (less so for me, but if it means he survives then I'm okay with it). He is INCREDIBLY picky about milk temperature. If it's slightly too cold or slightly too hot he rejects it totally. Ugh. Of course it's my luck to have a picky kid as my first bottle baby.

    I'm really getting a crash course, this has been a horrible year. First we had the young nubian FF give birth to a baby that was found dead (not sure if it was stillborn or got too cold before we found it - even though the span of her not being in labor at all and me going to the barn because I felt something "off" was an hour). Then the Nigi doe required help (luckily two beautiful bucks were born and are doing fine now), then the Mini-Alpine and the 3rd Freshener Nubian gave birth at the same time, two of the Nubian's kids were dead when I got there (one had a broken neck, not sure about the other one) and the third was rejected by momma and is in an exercise pen with a stuffed Spongebob in my house.

    So, for our kidding season so far we have 5 live kids out of 8 born. 4 of them are bucks. I was definitely hoping for more does and obviously more alive. Something must be wrong with what I'm doing, that's the only thing I can think of.

    Sorry, that was a total vent/whine, but I feel just awful. I checked those ladies RELIGIOUSLY and have been watching them like a hawk since before the first and the one time I was late getting down there is when this all happened.
     
  13. jodief100

    jodief100 New Member

    276
    Jan 15, 2011
    Sounds like a rough year! I am so sorry for you. I do not know where you are but a lot of people around here are having difficulties this year. Most of the old timers suspect it was the dry fall we had. Not as much nutrition in the foarge at the end of the season and not as much in the hay we have now. It doesn't sound like you are doing anything wrong, just things happen. :hug:

    I hope things go better and so happy for the babies you have. :love:

    I am still waiting for mine.
     
  14. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    Is she able to kick him when he is trying to nurse discouraging him and making him afraid? If she is... or if she isn't holding still she will have to be tied tighter so she cannot move around....

    When you try him on momma's teat tickle the top area of his tail head on the back to stimulate him to feed.....it is what his momma is suppose to do....

    Good idea to call a vet on the retained placenta.... :hug:

    Take her temp and see what it is.... before treatment...

    It wouldn't hurt to give her something for milk fever....just in case...


    If the baby has a full tummy....and isn't yelling out hungry...he should be OK.... just watch him... being picky is a pain....for sure....but whatever it takes to get him through....right...

    Sorry you are having a bad year....Prayers sent your way for it to start getting better.... :hug: :pray:
    It is OK to vent... that is what we are here for.... :hug:
     
  15. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    I agree, it sounds like a rough year, I am so sorry for your loses. I'm sure your doing a fine job, and things happen that we just can not control :( It sounds like your little bottle baby is hanging in there, and how funny that he is already a picky eater! I'm just picturing a little sweetie snuggled up with........spongebob. Spongebob the babysitter? hehe....

    Lots of thoughts and prayers going out to you, and your goaties. I know I would be feeling so awful too if it was happening here, so my heart is with you.
     
  16. fruittartcaprines

    fruittartcaprines New Member

    145
    Mar 3, 2010
    I had her tied about as well as I could tie her, she's a big doe and she even ripped apart the milking stand when I tried that. I'm here all alone which doesn't help and she just butted him last time, so I'm pretty sure it's going to be a no go. She's a difficult and headstrong doe even not-pregnant (though I love her dearly, she's a needy pushy girl) so maybe it's best that he doesn't learn from her.

    Spongebob has been lovingly donated by my son to help keep the babe company as he's all alone up here. Spongebob is currently in the dryer after being pooped on by said babe.

    He's drinking about 3 oz every 4 hours via actually sucking. I'm not sure how much he's getting while I'm trickling it in trying to get him to suck. Either way, I'm not convinced it's enough though he's pooping and peeing just fine - he's moved on to yellow poops not just black meconium.

    *PSA* Do not just throw things with even the yellow poop in the washing machine. You will have to clean said washing machine with a scrub brush because it does NOT wash out. Ugh, the stuff is everywhere!

    I'm really worried about him and Rende both. His poop is a little smelly but it looks normal. Could he have gotten too much rich colostrum at once?
     
  17. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    What breed is he again? About how much does he weigh? It sound to me like he is fine and you are doing everything right.
     
  18. fruittartcaprines

    fruittartcaprines New Member

    145
    Mar 3, 2010
    He's a mini-Nubian (1/2 Nubian, 1/2 Nigerian) and he weighs 6.8 lbs. I'm actually a bit surprised by his weight, as she is a BIG doe, and I would have expected him to weigh more, but he was one of 3 and the smallest out of them.
     
  19. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    Sounds like you are feeding him just right then :)
     
  20. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    the yellow poop is normal

    Have you tried a bottle? what kind of nipples do you have? I like the pritchard nipples