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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi everyone! I've been away for a little while. I keep getting slammed with discouragement and negative experiences and I just don't know what to do. I love my goats and do my absolute best to care for them as best as I can. We have a vet on call, we run fecals, and I'm constantly looking at my care protocol to see what I can do better.

Recently I sold a couple of 6 month old doelings. I always check my animals prior to selling. I would never sell an animal if I thought it was sick or not doing well. A few days after these does went to their new home the buyer said they weren't bouncing around as they expected. I offered some advice, kept in touch, confirmed that I hadn't had any issues or seen anything that would lead me to believe they were sickly. A few days later the buyer vocalized more concern about one of the doelings and said they just didn't like it and wanted to trade it for a different one. I agreed, but the one that they wanted was already sold. I was out of town but let them know that the next weekend they could come look at another doeling. The next day the doeling died in their care. After that I hesitated on giving a new animal to them. I had other people lined up to buy, but have put a hold on all sales at the moment because I just don't know what to do.

At this point I just don't want to sell any more goats because it's just so stressful. Do I need to create a disclaimer that says they are sold as-is and no returns? What would be the best practice here? I've already decided that I will not sell an animal unless I have recent fecal results so I can hand that over at the point of sale.

What would you do?
 

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Once they leave your farm, you can't be responsible. If the buyers thought the goats were sick, why didn't they take them to the vet? Parasite blooms can happen when goats are stressed but that is the responsibility of the buyer. When you sell goats, you should always tell the buyer that you aren't responsible once the goat leaves your property. For all you know, they fed moldy hay or too much grain or something.
 

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I make my buyers read and agree to my terms of sale before making a purchase. The terms state, among other things, that once the goat leaves my property I cannot and will not be responsible for its health and care. I would never let a sick goat leave my farm, but once the goat leaves, it's health is beyond my control. For younger kids who I know will be traveling more than an hour or two to get to their destination, I do preventatively treat with toltrazuril in case of a coccidia bloom, since that is so common even with healthy kids.

So sorry about the kid though. That is heartbreaking ☹
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks y'all. I have to remind myself that it wasn't like the doeling walked off the property and died, it was a week later. I just hate the whole situation. I don't want it to seem like I gave a buyer a bad deal or cheated them or anything like that. I think I just need to be more upfront about no returns and maybe go through a health check with them there or something. My husband said maybe have a very recent fecal result to give to buyers sort of as proof.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I make my buyers read and agree to my terms of sale before making a purchase. The terms state, among other things, that once the goat leaves my property I cannot and will not be responsible for its health and care. I would never let a sick goat leave my farm, but once the goat leaves, it's health is beyond my control. For younger kids who I know will be traveling more than an hour or two to get to their destination, I do preventatively treat with toltrazuril in case of a coccidia bloom, since that is so common even with healthy kids.

So sorry about the kid though. That is heartbreaking ☹
I did add to my plan to give a preventative of toltrazuril before transport. How soon prior to leaving do you give it to yours? I really am heartbroken over this. I loved the little baby and should have just kept her here!
 

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I agree. It's hard to say what happens once they leave. When I sell a goat..we check famacha, I give kids toltrazuril and give advice in what to watch for..we talk about parasite bloom and stress related shipping fever ect. I always let them know they can to call me if they ever have an issue. Once they leave with the goat..its their responsibility.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I agree. It's hard to say what happens once they leave. When I sell a goat..we check famacha, I give kids toltrazuril and give advice in what to watch for..we talk about parasite bloom and stress related shipping fever ect. I always let them know they can to call me if they ever have an issue. Once they leave with the goat..its their responsibility.
Thank you. I like this a lot. I'm going to have to work on my sale practice I think. I am painfully shy sometimes and I worry that saying no refunds or washing my hands of it might come across as cold or unfriendly, but it's really just the business side of it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
May I ask how they were transported ? Were they used to being handled? We have found that those two things can play a huge role as well as having a plan to get acclimated to their new home which is really the buyers responsibility.
They were transported in a cage together in the back of a truck. I'm not sure how far, but I don't believe it was too long of a journey. They were both very used to being handled, especially the one that died. She would come to be for cuddles.
 

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They were transported in a cage together in the back of a truck. I'm not sure how far, but I don't believe it was too long of a journey. They were both very used to being handled, especially the one that died. She would come to be for cuddles.
sounds like there were many factors that may have caused the undesirable outcome. There are so many things with out knowing vegetation etc, quality of water, etc. Did they request a necropsy?

it’s a little hard to take when you give them your best and something happens beyond your control.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
sounds like there were many factors that may have caused the undesirable outcome. There are so many things with out knowing vegetation etc, quality of water, etc. Did they request a necropsy?

it’s a little hard to take when you give them your best and something happens beyond your control.
As far as I know there was no necropsy done. I was told the doeling had a snotty nose so she was caged alone overnight and when they went to check the next morning she had died. They started listing all the things that were done (dewormed, supplements, iron, etc) and I am wondering if it's possible the doeling was already stressed and then given too much all at once for her system. Previously, I hadn't given her anything other than her two rounds of CD&T and preventative toltrazuril, though it had been a month since her last dose of that.
 

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I did add to my plan to give a preventative of toltrazuril before transport. How soon prior to leaving do you give it to yours? I really am heartbroken over this. I loved the little baby and should have just kept her here!
I give it the morning of the day they leave. I like to give them a dose of probiotics too when I can, although that doesn't always happen.

Try not to beat yourself up over it. I know it feels like you failed your little doeling, but she was healthy when she left and you sold her to a home that you thought would take good care of her. There isn't anything more you could possibly have done.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I give it the morning of the day they leave. I like to give them a dose of probiotics too when I can, although that doesn't always happen.

Try not to beat yourself up over it. I know it feels like you failed your little doeling, but she was healthy when she left and you sold her to a home that you thought would take good care of her. There isn't anything more you could possibly have done.
Thank you so much. I did feel like I was making the right choice for her new home. I hate that it went this way. I'm definitely going to do the pre-sale toltrazuril, probiotics and probably even a fecal so I can hand over the proof of good results at the point of sale.
 

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With the snotty nose, I wonder about the possibility of pneumonia. If the other goat is still not acting right, she should really be seen by a vet. She may need antibiotics.
With something like pneumonia, that is in no way your fault. The stress of moving can really tax a goat's immune system. If she was healthy when she left your place, that is the best you can do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
With the snotty nose, I wonder about the possibility of pneumonia. If the other goat is still not acting right, she should really be seen by a vet. She may need antibiotics.
With something like pneumonia, that is in no way your fault. The stress of moving can really tax a goat's immune system. If she was healthy when she left your place, that is the best you can do.
The other one I sold her seems to be doing great. I am really thinking it was the stress of moving that started it all.
 

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You absolutely need a contract! I have one that basically states I guarantee nothing because so many things can go wrong in a new home that I have no idea is going to happen. And there is nothing that says that if I some how was in the wrong and sold them a less then healthy goat that I couldn’t refund money, as long as I was sure it was my or the animals fault.
Don’t get discouraged. Unfortunately sometimes these things happen. I have been in your shoes and have second guessed myself and what I stand for. I usually sit back and look at it from both sides. From your side of the story you did good on making sure you sold them a healthy baby. They at any time could have called a vet out to see what was going on. If we ALL know anything about these animals it can be that they are easily stress and can be fickle at times. That doesn’t put you in the wrong.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
You absolutely need a contract! I have one that basically states I guarantee nothing because so many things can go wrong in a new home that I have no idea is going to happen. And there is nothing that says that if I some how was in the wrong and sold them a less then healthy goat that I couldn’t refund money, as long as I was sure it was my or the animals fault.
Don’t get discouraged. Unfortunately sometimes these things happen. I have been in your shoes and have second guessed myself and what I stand for. I usually sit back and look at it from both sides. From your side of the story you did good on making sure you sold them a healthy baby. They at any time could have called a vet out to see what was going on. If we ALL know anything about these animals it can be that they are easily stress and can be fickle at times. That doesn’t put you in the wrong.
Do you have to have them sign the contract? I think I'll write something up for sure.
 

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Yes they sign it at the time they either put a deposit on a goat or they buy the goat (if old enough to leave). Just take your time and try and cover all your bases, and what your willing to work with. Pretty much think of every little issue that might come up and how you would like to handle it.
 

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Yes protect yourself! Once they leave your farm it its no longer on you. People can be real jerks and come back later demanding money back or vet money due to lack of care on their part. Dont blame yourself! Parasites usually hit em when they leave and are stressed. No telling also what was already at thier property maybe they didnt use proper prevention.
 
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