An Avalon and Bam Bam update

Discussion in 'Horses' started by keren, Jan 24, 2013.

  1. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    Lets keep it friendly this time ;)

    Both horses are doing well!

    Bam Bam has been on HEAVY antibiotics for 7 days now with his last a/bs to be given tomorrow morning. On bute for a couple days but he hated it so we gave up on that pretty quickly. Continuing the poulticing and soaking in epsom salts. We have seen a huge improvement - last saturday he was hopping along on three legs - he now placed the foot flat on the ground and walks on it - though still quite a decent limp. I have to stop in at the vets this afternoon to have a chat with her and see if she wants to move on to the next step which is x rays.

    Avalon is doing better although I havent done a lot of work with her due to nursing Bam Bam. Still we have had some good sessions. Took a brush out and she just melted, loves being brushed. So we now start and finish our sessions with a good brushing. Last Sunday I took a towel out with me and threw it over her back like a saddle blanket. I also draped it all over her head, neck, bum etc and like everything she was a bit nervous at first but after a few minutes she was totally fine with it. Yesterday I held her front foot up for about 4 - 5 seconds, and did that twice. So - progress - just very slow progress :hammer:My friend Anna came out last night to meet her, and walked right up to her in the paddock and Avs let her rub all over her head, which she certainly would not have done a few weeks ago :clap: yay Avs! such a brave girl. Course the carrots probably helped lol.

    My other friend Kyla who is taking on Bam Bam came out last Sunday, and she was so impressed with the change in Avs. She said she is a completely different horse to when she last saw her. She said she is so much more relaxed and totally focused on me, when last time she was very nervous and looking at everything else instead of me.

    She is getting so much better at just standing still next to me. I just tell her to lower her head and she 'switches off' and just stands there.

    I tried an experiment, getting Kyla to pick up her feet while I held her and reassured her, and it was a no go. Not gonna happen says Avs. I had hoped that if we could do that, I could get a farrier but nope, she only trusts me to handle her legs at the moment.

    Going to be doing another experiment on the weekend. As we find out more about the back story of these horses, it seems Avs was abused by a man, and she has been terrified of men ever since. Apparently she has never allowed any of the male farm hands to get near her. She wasnt even too keen on women coming near her when we started this whole thing. She's getting a lot better though learning that people (females) she doesnt know arent necessarily going to hurt her, so this weekend I am going to try to introduce her to a man and see how she goes. My friend Shaggy cant wait to meet her since hearing I got a horse, he used to train racehorses when he was younger. So he is happy to be my guinea pig to see how she will take to meeting a man. He is not a big guy and quite softly spoken so hopefully doesnt seem too threatening. If she's good with him we can move on to my hubby who is a big tough guy :D

    Its really important to me that she learns to react favourably around strangers, as she has bonded so well to me I can see it becoming somewhat of an issue. She beat the crap out of the bay mare (who we named Princess) because she came walking over to me. she is very protective of me which I obviously need to nip in the bud. I obviously also need to her learn to stay calm when being examined by vet/dentist/farrier or just if I go away and someone else looks after the critters.

    Interesting the more backstory we seem to be uncovering about these horses. Apparently my vet was actually called to stitch up Avs' head injury when it happened, but she refused because the 'owners' were known to be bad debtors, had vet bills racked up with several clinics in the area, and were not going to be there to pay up front. Also rumor has it that the injury was caused by a sledgehammer or star picket to her head. Who knows if that is true or not though, its just what the rumor mill is saying. Also apparently someone tried to steal Bam a little while ago but must not have been able to get him on the float - next day all the horses were stirred up, he was wearing a headcollar when he previously wasnt, and there were tyre marks in the paddock.

    Princess (bay TB mare) was supposed to go to her new home yesterday - but when her new owner went to get the paddock and stable ready - she found that her flat mate had put two horses in there! Yet its an entire property that she actually owns (not the flat mate) and she only uses this one paddock, flat mate uses the rest of it. Bit rude. So anyway she needs to sort that out before bringing Princess home. Vet came to look at her infected eye and said its improving (grass seed came out) and continue bathing in salt water and hopefully avoid antibiotics, but its a nasty one, the grass seed actually punctured the cornea and may be a permanent blind spot.

    Phew what a novel! I will try to get someone to take some pictures of us working this weekend
     
  2. Delilah

    Delilah New Member

    Jan 6, 2013
    That's awesome good job with Av! So glad to hear an update on them I was really wondering about them.
     

  3. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    [​IMG]

    Pretty sure she thinks I've lost my marbles for making her do this LOL. Tomorrow we will be repeating it with a tarp.

    Good news again about Bam, spoke to the vet and we are taking him off antibiotics for a few days to see how he goes, continuing soaking/poulticing. She says if he stays the same or improves, all good. If he goes backwards we will go back onto antibiotics for another week.
     
  4. onehorse_2000

    onehorse_2000 New Member

    150
    Sep 17, 2012
    LOL, vets should be required to take continuing education credits from competent individuals to prevent situations like this and owners should have the money, time, and/or know-how to care for said animal or not have that animal at all. I know this information has been recommended by many on this and many other boards and forums.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  5. KarmakeeFarm

    KarmakeeFarm New Member

    635
    Jun 2, 2012
    what a great ending to a terrible life for those poor horses1 Good for you for having the patience~ shes a beautiful mare -even with the towel on her head!
     
  6. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    That is great that things are going well. Hopefully all the healing including mental/emotional will continue. :)
     
  7. Used2bmimi

    Used2bmimi New Member

    Oct 2, 2012
    Western Colorado
    Yay! Great job on all counts! I am so glad you are going to keep giving us updates. I have been wondering how things were going.
     
  8. That's good to hear, glad you are making progress.It's sad a bad experience takes 3 times longer to 'fix' in their mind
     
  9. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    Thank you everyone :D im so happy with them both. The change from potatoes to good pasture and minerals has been amazing. Avs has lost fat and toned muscle.. Her white is whiter and red spots brighter and her feet are shaping up even without a trim.

    Not sure what you mean onehorse, it was the MASSIVE amounts of antibiotics that tuened him around but people here were saying dont give abs. Just goes to show there is more than one way to skin a cat. Also not sure about the money comment since we have invested $500 in this horse and ive already pre paid $300 for Avs to have a full vet check and her teeth done next weekend
     
  10. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
  11. onehorse_2000

    onehorse_2000 New Member

    150
    Sep 17, 2012
    LOL, it is still very early, I definitely wouldn't say the antibiotics cured anything, as it is still brewing. And, I remember someone saying about not being able to afford a farrier to get the mare trimmed properly too.
     
  12. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    He was getting worse just poulticing ... Add antibiotics and he has shown dramatic improvement! To me that indicates abs worked :)

    I have reaaons for wanting to do her feet myself and its not because i cant afford a farrier.

    1. I know how to trim feet myself so why pay someone else to do something i am capable of.

    2. She has huge trust issues from being abused particularly when it comes to her feet. Prior to me taking her on a farrier saw her withour much success. He trimmed a bit off each front then stopped, saying he could push the issue and get it done but it would stress her too much, and it would bezt if her issues could be resolved. I agree completely. It has taken three weeks to get her to a point where i can handle her feet but she isnt up to having strangers do it yet.

    3. All the farriers around me either wont see her because she is 'difficult' or are so busy they arent taking new clients. I do have details of two willing to do her but i need to float her there.

    I have always said if she was lame i would not hesitate to have her sedated and the feet done. Since she is still getting around fine i believe continuing with our current action plan is what is best for her. Please understand that.
     
  13. RowdyKidz

    RowdyKidz Senior Member

    Apr 2, 2009
    NW Ohio
    Keren, not sure if you remember me or not from long ago but I think it's awesome what you have been doing for these horses! Not many folks would want to step up to the plate and take responsibility for an animal (let alone 3) that don't belong to you. Especially horses! I work at a grain mill, I know how much horse grains are!

    On a slight side note, I am really bothered by a few comments about Vets... I am a Junior in HS and all my life I have admired Vets and wanted to be one. I am very well educated when it comes to livestock care, vaccines, wormings, etc. I do my own shots, treatments, wormings, kiddings, etc and I have since I was about 10 years old. Vets endure 8 years of schooling and only the top 5% make it past their pre-vet degree. Everyone has different ways of doing things, including Vets, but seriously? They went to school for 8 years, they aren't as dumb as some of you seem to think. I trust a Vet's opinion until I have ONE reason not to. Vets aren't perfect, but everyone makes mistakes. I know Vet Bills today are horrible but if my animal's have a problem that I don't know how to fix on my own, you can bet I'm willing to pay the $$ to make sure the problem is found.

    Sorry, I will get off my soapbox. But seriously Keren, I totally admire you for taking in those horses! Especially in today's age, horses aren't cheap! Especially ones needing antibiotics and vet treatment!
     
  14. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    Tara of course I remember you! Its so nice to see you back again :) even if its not that often.

    yeah I agree with you re vets. Everyone complains about vets and how they could do such a better job and how they know more about horses/goat etc than their vet does but I dont reckon theres many people who could do what a vet does. They know a heap about so many different species, you cannot expect them to be an expert in every species unless you go to an equine specialist, goat specialist etc. and most people dont, they go to their GP vet and berate them for not being an expert in every animal. I've been to uni with vet students and the sheer level of content that they learn astounds me.

    My vet is great, she knows a LOT about every species and is an expert in some. She talks to me about everything she is thinking regarding a case. She asks what I have done to treat the animal already, and commends what I have done because nine times out of ten its what she would have done anyway. We have a good working relationship because she knows I will do the preliminary stuff and all the nursing and when its time to take the next step I will contact her but not hesitate and we generally get it early. She is very fair on her prices - the vet bill for Bam Bam was itemized for the consult and the antibiotics but she didnt charge me for the bute and syringes/needles. She is very conscious about keeping prices low, and will always work within a budget and try the cheapest option first. She also lets me pay the bill off if I need to - I try to do right by her and at least pay the first hundred on the spot. My first experience with this vet I lost the goat, partly because I didnt trust my instincts and convince her to do it the way I wanted to. Instead I let her convince me to keep the doe going a bit longer (she had preg tox) and I lost the doe and all the kids, and had a $300 vet bill. Do I blame my vet for this? Hell no! I know some people would never go back to that vet. But she was respectful to me, to the goat, and she really knew what she was doing and handled my doe beautifully, she did everything right and theres no telling whether we would have lost the doe even if we did it my way. Yes everyone makes mistakes. I have made lots of mistakes and learned from them. My vet does the best job she can, always gives 110%, I cannot fault her.

    Sorry for the rant. I admire many vets and look up to them. The vets I DONT like are the ones that will not listen to a goat breeder, will not try new ideas that I come up with, or the ones that refuse to see my goats because 'we dont do goats' even though they see sheep and cattle. My last vet (before I moved to the other side of the country) freely admitted that she wasnt experienced with goats but never hesitated to see my goats and treat them, was always open and honest about what she wanted to try, she was incredible and she saved many goats for me.
     
  15. Used2bmimi

    Used2bmimi New Member

    Oct 2, 2012
    Western Colorado
    Keren, you are doing wonderful things for these horses and you have made wise decisions. I think it is always better to take the advice of a trusted vet and follow your own instincts than to do nothing or follow unknown advice from people you don't even know. (So that said, here is a little advice from a person you don't even know:D...maybe if you ignore the nasties and stop responding to their thinly veiled taunts they will quit. And if not, we can all flag the unfriendly posts each time.) I am glad to hear of the horses' progress and look forward to hearing about the rest of your journey. Avalon looks to make your life busy and fun for a while!
     
  16. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    Avs met a MAN tonight and she did very well! We did approach and retreat and he also had carrots for her. She was uncomfortable and unsure but she tolerated him, and stayed switched off when i gave her the cue. She let him pat her head even. Very very pleased. Brave girl. He loves her and cant wait till he can have a ride down the track. Its been a long time since he was around horses but hes very gentle with them. He was so happy to be round them again.
     
  17. onehorse_2000

    onehorse_2000 New Member

    150
    Sep 17, 2012
    That is absolutely true, put it on antibiotics, see improvement, it must be cured. Kinda like an infection with a bacterial component, sinus, uterine, etc.

    X-rays would be a good move at this point to be able to document the deterioration of P3, but I wouldn't put this gelding through that because invariably, this vet would want to cut out any pocket she found and then we definitely are moving from cure rates to survival rates. Your vet does not understand the purpose of an abcess in the foot of the horse and this horse will continue to suffer due to that.

    Unfortunately, what has been done is done, but PLEASE, would someone please put a spot to this posting, someone is likely to pick this information up and thing that this is the correct way to handle an abcess in a horse.

    This reminds me of Barbaro and Chris Reeves!
     
  18. Used2bmimi

    Used2bmimi New Member

    Oct 2, 2012
    Western Colorado
  19. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
  20. kghorse

    kghorse New Member

    4
    Jan 28, 2013
    I am so very sorry, been lurking for a while, but absolutely agree with Onehorse-2000, you have been lead in the wrong direction by your vet and it will probably be a death sentence for this poor gelding.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 1, 2013