Disoriented Doe ?? Help ...

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by Julie, Apr 16, 2008.

  1. Julie

    Julie New Member

    464
    Oct 5, 2007
    Southern PA
    I was doing barn work, and just got everyone fed and had my back turned to Noel (my 4 month old mini nubian doe) when one of the bigger goats apparantly rammed her. I heart her "grunt" and turned and looked and she was laying on the ground ~ not getting up. I hollered for her and she wouldn't get up - she was laying in like a sleeping position with her head up and alert - but she wouldn't get up off the ground, and her eyes/head looked like she was dioriented - her eyes were kind of "shaky" as if she couldn't focus correctly, and her head was a little wobbly - same thing - as if she couldn't focus. I went over and picked her up to see if she could stand - she stood there but wouldn't move. Then she tried to walk and stumbled around like a drunk. And then decided to just stand still. So I took her out of the pen and she's now in the open part of my barn where a couple of the kids are playing. She's just standing around looking disoriented, or dizzy. Will she be ok ? Should I be worried ? (cause I am - until I get some opinions saying that she'll be fine after a few minutes or so).

    HELP
     
  2. kelebek

    kelebek New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    South Texas
    I would watch her closely. I would also rub down her body and see if she has any broken ribs. Another thing that you can do is take a flash light and check to see if her pupils will constrict when you shine the light at them. If they don't then she could have a concusion (sp).

    I hope that she just got a little dazed and will be ok!

    Allison
     

  3. dobe627

    dobe627 Senior Member

    Oct 16, 2007
    southeast PA
    Since you don't know where she was hit, keep an eye on her gum color. Pale can mean internal bleeding. Check her CRT( capillary refill time) when you press on her gums( normal colored) they turn white for a second, if they stay white then you will need to worry. But hopefully she only got the wind knocked out of her. I hope she is ok
     
  4. sweetgoats

    sweetgoats Moderator

    Oct 18, 2007
    Peyton CO.
    Julie, I am so sorry. I know how scary that can be.

    Just sending good thoughts and hoping all is going to be fine. Keep us posted.
     
  5. liz

    liz Active Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    I hope she is doing better for you. Using the light in her eyes is a very good suggesstion, she may have a concussion especially if she was rammed against the fence.
     
  6. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    I spoke to Julie, I to believe it is a concussion either from wiplash from being butted or from her hitting her head on the stall wall.

    She wanted to know how long it should take her to get out of it so to speak and I was thinking 24 hours with no improvement would be bad. Would everyone agree or do you think it takes longer?
     
  7. Julie

    Julie New Member

    464
    Oct 5, 2007
    Southern PA
    Stacey - thanks for calling me to help Noel ... I really appreciate it !

    Update (other than Stacey - since we already talked about all this) ..

    Noel is seperated from my does right now, and is in the open part of my barn where my hay is kept, and where I let my kids out to play together each day. She is continuing to act "drunk" and disoriented, but IS eating the hay that's there. She isn't grinding her teeth or anything like that - and like I said - is eating hay. So I don't think that she's in pain - atleast she doesn't act like it at all. Her only problem is being disoriented.
    And I did put a flashlight up to her eyes, and I will say, I could not see her pupils dilate. I tried it on one of the other kids - just for a comparison, and from what I can tell - Noel's pupils are not dilating to the light. So I'm assuming as STacey said - that she had a concusion.
    She does not seem sleepy, and has been standing eating hay (atleast each time I was down to check on her). I will continue to keep an eye on her.

    WHEN can she safely sleep ?
    And WHEN should she be her "normal" self again ? (without the dizziness,etc.)
     
  8. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    The pupils should both get smaller when you shine light in them. Did both of them stay big or just one?
     
  9. enjoytheride

    enjoytheride New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Humboldt Co Ca
    Is she ataxic- wobbles or walks drunk when she walks or is she not responsive to her environment too?
    I would ask a vet before I did this but I would think a steroid of some kind to reduce swelling might be a good idea fairly fast. But not an antiinflammitory like asprin as it could increase bleeding if ahe does have a concussion.
     
  10. Julie

    Julie New Member

    464
    Oct 5, 2007
    Southern PA
    The pupils did not appear to dilate.

    Yes, she walks drunken and wobbly and off balance. And can't seem to focus very well.

    She is walking around a little more - even though she did not change as far as being wobbly and off balance. But she's trying. And she is and has been eating hay.
    She just looks "spaced out" ... eyes and all.

    I did call my vet (even though they are DUMB with goats - but concusion would be a general thing - not just goat related, so I called)
    My vet said to give child's aspirin (81 ml. every 8 hours) and to just watch her. He said she could be like this for a while and not to worry if she's still this way after 24hrs. He said to worry if she's STILL like this after about 48 hours - then I'm suppose to call him if that's the case.

    He wanted me to give her Banomine (sp?) but I don't have that. So he said just to use the child's aspirin.

    I didn't give her the aspirin yet ~ and now am curious if I should or not due to ...
    So what should I do ? Give the aspirin (after I hunt some down - cause I don't have that either), or DON'T give the aspirin ? Any other suggestions ?
     
  11. Julie

    Julie New Member

    464
    Oct 5, 2007
    Southern PA
    btw - the vet also thinks that according to what I told him - she has a concusion
     
  12. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    I wouldn't give the aspirin if it was me. Like enjoytheride said its a blood thinner. I would think it could cause her to bleed into her brain, but thats just my thinking.
     
  13. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Julie did the vet say that there is bleeding in the brain with a concussion?

    Because from all that i have read on it before consulting you here with this is that there is no bleeding in the brain associated with a cuncussion.

    That was taken from an artical on cuncussions found on the internet.

    I would go ahead and give her the asprin. Do not give Tylonal.

    81mg is the usual dosage for a kid so if you have adult asprin give a smaller amount of it.
     
  14. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    Yes but if she has a contusion then she could be bleeding. There is no way to tell without a CT scan.

    Not trying to be negative, just saying. We just went over head injuries in my EMT class. It was weird to come on and see this post right after it. lol Seems like something always happens after class that relates to class.. its weird.

    I really hope that this is just a concussion and that she fine tomorrow.
     
  15. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    ok so what is worse, treating her for the wrong thing or not treating her at all?

    such a hard decision on this sort of thing
     
  16. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    I know, I'm torn between what I would do.

    Is there another vet you could call and ask for a second opinion?
     
  17. Tog Lovers

    Tog Lovers New Member

    182
    Oct 10, 2007
    Greensburg, PA
    I would give the asprin. If there is bleeding on the brain then the damage is already done and if there was bleeding on the brain she would be getting worse and would also be in obvious pain due to the fact that there wouldn't be room for the extra fluid in there. (3 teenage boys = lots of injuries) And asprin would help keep a small bleed from clotting. Small bleeds usually heal themselves. But a clot could cause a stroke. I really do think that if she is eating and seems to be steadily improving she will be fine.

    Just my 2 cents.
     
  18. liz

    liz Active Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    Just wondering if she is improving at all. The lite shined in her eyes would cause the pupils to get smaller, which would say that she is reacting to the lite, which would be a good thing, does she pull away from you at all when you touch her head? If so, I would say she has a "headache"
     
  19. enjoytheride

    enjoytheride New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Humboldt Co Ca
    I always thought that a concussion was a bruising of the brain which could be caused by the brain being bounced into the skull. Even if it qA bruise, I don't think that I would want to use asprin. I have used steroids like Azium on horses but have no knowledge of its affect on goats.
    If the vet said asprin- then I would probably think he knows what he is talking about.
    I wonder whether that are any plants that act as an anti-iflamitory- maybe willow leaves??? I'm not much of a holistic practicioner.
     
  20. Julie

    Julie New Member

    464
    Oct 5, 2007
    Southern PA
    UPDATE

    Noel is doing better (Thank You God !)
    Still loopy and not completely focused or balanced - but she is walking around alot more ! And also is looking for grain. She was up and about the entire time I was in the barn to milk Mika and bottlefeed Cotton Candy. Like I said - she's still unbalanced though, and she did go to shake (how they shake their whole body sometimes) and fell over ...hahaha (poor girl). But she seems alot better than earlier. And her eyes look a little better to - she looks like she can focus more than what she could before, but still not completely right yet - you can still see her eyes looking kind of "spacey" yet.

    While I was down there - I did give her the children's aspirin. I hope to God I did the right thing ! She chewed it up like candy. Which reminds me - I left the rest of the aspirin down there in a baggy ! I hope the cats don't get into it thinking it's candy !! I better run down and get it !!! DUMB ME !