Disoriented kid

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by JearDOE Ranch, Apr 10, 2019.

  1. JearDOE Ranch

    JearDOE Ranch Active Member

    161
    Aug 23, 2018
    Kansas
    We raise Boer goats. We have a kid, two months old, sudden onset of symptoms just came on today. We do not have a thermometer. He weighs about 30 lbs.

    He's disoriented- went to nurse and completely missed both bags. Walks slow, very sluggish. Seems to be dizzy. He swaggers when he walks, and weak.

    Husband just gave him 2 cc's of Baytril 100.

    I have not been out to see him yet. Husband called me when I was in town (20 minutes ago) and I just got home.

    Edited to add:: I went and bought a thermometer. 48 minutes lapses since my husband called to tell me of the kid's symptoms and that he had just given the meds until I took the kids temperature. It's 98.5. I just looked at normal goat temp. I am not positive I got the thermometer into the rectum. I will try again.

    I'm researching online and found goat polio or listeriosis could possibly be the culprit. Still researching though.

    Update 5/3/2019:: Update: Got a call from the vet who oversaw the necropsy. It was not goat polio. She said that would have been easy to tell from the brain tissue. It was not meningitis. And it was not rabies. In fact, there wasn't any evidence of any neurological at all. She didn't have any answers for us. Just more questions about his symptoms. They were stumped.

    UPDATE 8/4/19:: Onion Creek Ranch, who has a website full of wonderful information, posted just a week ago a situation identical to ours from someone I assume came to them for answers. Their kid had died also. The only differences were the kid was 4 months instead of two and no temperature was mentioned. The culprit? Being over dewormed or rotating dewomer. The parasites developed an immunity to the dewormer. The goats body reacted by lowering the red blood cell count resulting in the kid being anemic. The issue the people in the post of Facebook did wrong was rotate dewormers. Never rotate!! We do not. So just know that even if you do rotate this can still happen!!!

    The treatment: Give a different dewormer. Test fecal after to make sure parasites are gone. Treat for anemia. There is an article for how to treat anemia at Onion Creek Ranch: https://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/anemiaingoats.html

    See FaceBook post here: https://www.facebook.com/onioncreek...otif_id=1564836825278317&notif_t=feed_comment
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019
  2. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Definitely get a good temp. Normal is 101.5 to 103.5. Does sound like polio/listeriosis. Good to treat for both.
     
    mariarose likes this.

  3. Sfgwife

    Sfgwife Well-Known Member

    Feb 17, 2018
    North Cakalaki
    Also the kid needs be warmed before he eats. His body temp. Eeds be 101 at least.
     
    groovyoldlady likes this.
  4. SalteyLove

    SalteyLove Well-Known Member

    Jun 18, 2011
    New England
    Get Penicillin, B-Complex, and Dexamethasone in to the kid ASAP
     
  5. happybleats

    happybleats Well-Known Member

    Sep 12, 2010
    Gustine Texas
    I would agree to treat for polio/listeriosis. Our protocol is
    500mg thiamine every 6 hours no matter his weight..so if you use B complex that is going to be a whopper of a dose..try to get thiamine from your vet as soon as you can. Its usually 500mg ..so 1 cc is way easier to give. But start with what you can get your hands on.
    We also do Pen G 1 cc per 10# sub Q every 6 hours. ALWAYS pull back the plunger to check for blood before you inject. Pen in the vein can kill the goat
    Banamine (if temp is with in normal range) 1/4 cc per 25# Sub Q once a day for 3 days to help with brain swelling. OR Dexamethasone ( 1 cc per 20# IM) once a day..but this is harder on his system and should be with direction of a vet when given long term.

    If it's polio, you will see improvement pretty quickly depending on how bad he is.
    Listeriosis, which is less likely with his age will take longer to recover from.
    Always continue treatment for a full 24 hours after he is 100%. We prefer to ween off meds to avoid a relapse
     
    groovyoldlady and Dwarf Dad like this.
  6. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    I agree with what has been said.

    How is the kids belly? Full or empty.
     
  7. SalteyLove

    SalteyLove Well-Known Member

    Jun 18, 2011
    New England
  8. JearDOE Ranch

    JearDOE Ranch Active Member

    161
    Aug 23, 2018
    Kansas
    I bought B complex drops for human consumption Wed night, it didn't have thiamine in it, so I bought B1 pills and crushed them up and added to the drops, gave him 1 1/2 ml. He went to the Vet Thursday morning. Low temperature confirmed, only 99 point something, so a little better. Vet doesn't know what he has, said it is neurological. Bought the injectable B1, vet prescribed Nuflor every other day for six days, then said to switch to another antibiotic and repeat. I'll have to ask my husband, I forget which.

    He's up and down, health wise. He was feeling well enough to go graze with the herd Saturday though no play. Come Sunday he was stumbling again and husband was worried he wouldn't be alive this morning. He is alive, but weak.

    I'll have to check his belly. Though I haven't noticed anything alarming, his mother doesn't nurse him when he's acting worse. We try to bottle feed, but he does fight the entire time refusing to swallow and lets the milk run down his face.
     
  9. SalteyLove

    SalteyLove Well-Known Member

    Jun 18, 2011
    New England
    Hmph.... It really sounds like Polio or Listeriosis not being treated aggressively enough and relapsing. Why did your veterinarian feel that this was not the correct diagnosis? Even if it's not the right diagnosis, the treatment is not harmful, and without a diagnosis I feel it would be better to try the treatment.

    He needs high doses of Thiamkne and Penicillin every 4-6 hours around the clock as well as daily Banamine or Dexamethasone. And this needs to continue 48 hours after symptoms completely disappear and then SLOWLY decrease the injections to prevent relapse. Even so, he will be very prone to relapse for months.
     
  10. NigerianDwarfOwner707

    NigerianDwarfOwner707 Well-Known Member

    May 17, 2018
    East Coast, USA
    To me this sounds more like polio than listeriosis. Just due to his age and the fact that he’s going up and down and well... still alive. I agree with all answers here. But to me, thiamine is the most critical thing he needs. But I’m curious, how are his legs? Is he wobbly at all?
     
  11. JearDOE Ranch

    JearDOE Ranch Active Member

    161
    Aug 23, 2018
    Kansas
    He's not wobbly at all anymore because he has not been able to stand for a few days now. His body is stiff. I go out and move his limbs around and change his position. He can lift his head, but for only a short period of time. I cradle his head while I feed him a bottle, but he's not drinking a lot.

    One thing that has been steady with his treatment is thiamine. That has never stopped.

    I would start the new treatment suggestions from you ladies if my husband had not already made up his mind we are going to a different vet. I'm taking him to Kansas State Vet hospital today. We feel he probably will not survive- the poor thing has been barely hanging on, but we want a confirmed diagnosis so we can be better equipped if we see this again.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
    Trollmor likes this.
  12. NigerianDwarfOwner707

    NigerianDwarfOwner707 Well-Known Member

    May 17, 2018
    East Coast, USA
    Have you discounted rabies? The paralysis sounds very similar.
     
  13. JearDOE Ranch

    JearDOE Ranch Active Member

    161
    Aug 23, 2018
    Kansas
    We have not. The thought hadn't crossed our minds to be honest. That would explain why mom wouldn't feed him though. I know animals can sense things.
     
  14. NigerianDwarfOwner707

    NigerianDwarfOwner707 Well-Known Member

    May 17, 2018
    East Coast, USA
    Rabies is hard for goats to contract but has he been vaccinated for it or been exposed to animals that are carriers?
     
  15. NigerianDwarfOwner707

    NigerianDwarfOwner707 Well-Known Member

    May 17, 2018
    East Coast, USA
    No moldy hay or feed or anything, right?
     
  16. SalteyLove

    SalteyLove Well-Known Member

    Jun 18, 2011
    New England
    Ugh - so sorry for this. I hope Kansas State can help today. If they send him home, be sure to have them teach you how to tube him so you can put fluids/milk replacer in his stomach.
     
  17. Trollmor

    Trollmor Well-Known Member

    Aug 19, 2011
    Goatless in Sweden
    Please use the real thing, not replacer! You have already given out so much money on this sick kid, so some 50 litres of real milk does not make any great difference!

    Good luck, and congratulations to such a kind husband!
     
  18. Goat Whisperer

    Goat Whisperer Well-Known Member

    556
    Dec 3, 2018
    How is his fecal? Do you hear any sounds from his stomach?
     
  19. NigerianDwarfOwner707

    NigerianDwarfOwner707 Well-Known Member

    May 17, 2018
    East Coast, USA
    Status update? Hope Kansas State will give you the answers you need.