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Do you use DE for worming?

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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well it seems like my endless flow of questions has ebbed a bit:oops:. So Exploring my options for worming. I have done a lot of research on DE and it seems like there are quite a few opinions on whether or not DE works as a de-wormer. Some people who use it say it does work, some (like the scientific studies) say it doesn't. Can I use DE alone as a wormer or will I have to use something with it? Is it cost efficient? If you personally don't like DE for worming or you use something else, I would love to hear what you use instead.
 

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I mix DE with the grain I give my goats at bedtime. I originally bought it for worming then researched more so now I mainly do it as a can't hurt might help sort of thing. If they need wormed i use whatever chemical wormer is recommended for the worms they have. I do find my goats just look better when they are eating it, though. That said, it's not something I would do without. I use it for fleas and mites, as pest control on my plants, every fire ant hill gets a healthy dose, after a rain I sprinkle down all the covered areas in the goat pen to keep flies down and make sure it's not getting wet. There are so many wonderful uses for it!
 

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Enough copper helps them tolerate worms. However, even with enough copper, enough exposure to parasites WILL need a boost from the correct parasiticides. I personally thk that food grade DE helps in many ways, just not against worms.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
There are preventions (as mentioned above), however, regular fecals keep you informed if your goats need treatment to rid them of parasites. At that point, chemical wormers are best to treat the problem.
So are you saying deworming is only something you need to do if it gets too bad? I thought worming was a constant uphill battle.
 

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If worming is a constant, and uphill battle, you should look at your management, and at your stock. Uphill battle indicates a losing battle, and if management is enforcing needing more and harsher worming, then you can't win.

Worming is something you need to stay on top of, but not something you will inevitably lose.

But It is more involved than just worming once in a while.
 
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Very good advice by all.

I find DE didn't work for lice. It was quite fine powdered and I did worry about it getting into the lungs. I don't use it anymore.

As to worming, no it does not.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
If worming is a constant, and uphill battle, you should look at your management, and at your stock. Uphill battle indicates a losing battle, and if management is enforcing needing more and harsher worming, then you can't win.

Worming is something you need to stay on top of, but not something you will inevitably lose.

But It is more involved than just worming once in a while.
So let me this straight: If it gets to the point that I feel like I need to use a dewormer than something I am doing is causing the worm load to get too high. I.e. my pasture is bad, their diet is wrong, the barn isn't clean enough. So if I am keeping healthy animals I won't need to deworm?
 

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No, I mean if you are fighting a constant and uphill (which means losing) battle, there is something wrong in the management. All of us have to use chemical wormers sometimes.
 
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I tried DE for external parasites, flies and other "bad" insects (fleas and ticks being 2 of them). It didn't do squat. I caught some flies and other bugs and placed them in a jar full of DE. They did not die. They lived in that jar full of DE for 2-3 weeks until I finally just sprayed them.

I didn't have much luck with herbal dewormers either.

Now I just do fecals and deworm those with the worst cases with whatever medication is labeled for those targeted worms.

Copper bolusing will help a goat fight off Barberpole worms but not really any others.
 

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Some people worm on a schedule, no matter the parasite specie or load. Others worm only as we see the need. Still others have a combination approach, automatically worming at some events like kidding, but otherwise waiting to match the need with the worming.
 
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Okay so now I'm confused... is this just one of those multiple answers questions?
Yes, my friend. It is. Hugs.

Step one. Determine which parasites you are most in danger of in your area.

Step two. Choose a good all purpose wormer that is effective against those parasites. Hint. The name will not include the words Safeguard, or Pellets

Step three. Worm your goats when they first arrive at your home.

Step four. Take a deep breath and keep researching, because now you've bought yourself some breathing room.

Again. Hugs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Yes, my friend. It is. Hugs.

Step one. Determine which parasites you are most in danger of in your area.

Step two. Choose a good all purpose wormer that is effective against those parasites. Hint. The name will not include the words Safeguard, or Pellets

Step three. Worm your goats when they first arrive at your home.

Step four. Take a deep breath and keep researching, because now you've bought yourself some breathing room.

Again. Hugs.
I love the way you write mariarose. Thanks for the encouragement.
 

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So let me this straight: If it gets to the point that I feel like I need to use a dewormer than something I am doing is causing the worm load to get too high. I.e. my pasture is bad, their diet is wrong, the barn isn't clean enough. So if I am keeping healthy animals I won't need to deworm?
My 2 cents and mostly regarding the parasite Haemonchus Contortus: occasional de-worming is almost a guaranteed thing when the conditions are right for the parasites to thrive: warm, wet weather, short grass (easier for the larva to climb to "eating height"), heavy dew in the morning; conditions where the larva can survive on the forage longer to have more chances of being ingested. Some things which you can control to help reduce the parasite load in your animals are: rotating grazing areas and being sure that forage is taller than shorter, not releasing the animals to the pasture until the morning dew has evaporated, and culling the animals which consistently need to be de-wormed.

Of course, like too many things in life, there are no black and white answers, so: the bit about taller forage than shorter forage has some pros and cons.

While talking to my vet about the Haemonchus Contortus (HC which are, coincidentally, my actual intials) and FEC (fecal egg counts) and parasites in general, she said that one of the most effective ways of controlling them, but which most producers will not do, is culling the ones which have the highest parasite load. That makes sense to me. What she also said, which I had not considered, is this: those with the higher worm loads are egg factories which are contaminating my pastures. I should have thought of that. So, getting rid of the more susceptible animals which are also huge egg factories, sounds like a great idea. I will begin that process as soon as I get a few more FEC's done of my herd to see trends in parasite loading. She also said, during another conversation, that a certain amount of parasite load is a good thing. However, I was already feeling like I was taking too much of her time and I didn't explore that with her (unfortunately). I can only say this: I'd rather have an animal with a few parasites and which I do not have to mess with (medicate) than an animal which is completely devoid of parasites only because they've been kept in a "glass jar" and away from parasites; a tolerant animal is better than a perfectly clean animal which you don't know how they'll respond when, not if, they get exposed.

Also, de-worming between the first freeze of winter and the last one can be highly effective (so I read) because you can kill the parasites (HC) in the L4 stage when they're dormant in the rumen. During the winter, I read (from TAMU, I think one publication was L-5095), the pasture boogers die from the cold conditions. Therefore, except for some eggs which may be laying dormant, the only parasite load you have (maybe) is in the animals' gut. Using a de-wormer that kills L4 HC should be very helpful. As I'm coming up on only my second winter since I started running goats and sheep, I will be trying this for the first time this year.

Finally, no, I wouldn't feel like having to de-worm occasionally means you're for certain doing anything wrong. If it means you were a lousy goat herd, then I'm a lousy goat herd, too. :-/

FWIW. HTH. YMMV. EIEIO.

--HC
 
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