Dr. Naylor Dehorning Paste. Good/Bad?

Discussion in 'Goat Management' started by firelight27, Apr 11, 2010.

  1. firelight27

    firelight27 Hopelessly Addicted

    Apr 24, 2009
    Southern Oregon
    http://www.jefferslivestock.com/ssc...=4X2FTBF9C5B99MDJ261M6071MKMQDNBF&pf_id=16159

    What do you guys think of this? Have you ever used it? The idea is that you rub this stuff on their horn buds at only a few days old (it is caustic), and it kills horn growth. You shave where the buds are, rub it on, leave it for 20-30 minutes, and then wash it off with water and then vinegar. Tadah. The end. Sounds too easy...It says you can simply hold the kid for a half hour so it doesn't rub the area on things/mom/other goats. What is the catch? Do you think there is a high percentage of failure?
     
  2. Shelly Borg

    Shelly Borg New Member

    361
    Nov 2, 2009
    Redding CA
    IMO bad
    The stories I have heard is kids screaming in pain for whole half hour. Kids scared , loss of eye sight if gotten in eye. Really bad stuff. Its acid. It burns.
     

  3. myfainters

    myfainters New Member

    Oct 29, 2009
    Lancaster, CA
    Horrible please don't use it! It has caused blindness in kids and can cause severe burns if it gets on your skin or theirs.
     
  4. firelight27

    firelight27 Hopelessly Addicted

    Apr 24, 2009
    Southern Oregon
    Thanks for the info. I agree after having searched around the net a bit more. Overall seems like a horrible product that everyone scream "NO!" about.
     
  5. AlaskaBoers

    AlaskaBoers New Member

    May 6, 2008
    Wasilla Alaska
    yeah. a huge no. I wonder why they even sell it anymore.
     
  6. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    well I've used it a hundred times and never had any problems with it ... calves and kids

    Put it on, duct tape over it so mum doesnt lick it off.

    easy and quick, and my babies have never screamed ...
     
  7. FunnyRiverFarm

    FunnyRiverFarm New Member

    Sep 13, 2008
    Hudson, MI
    I know a lady that used it and most of her goats have scurs...she may not have used it properly because I have heard of some people that have had success with it.

    Personally, I think that burning is much easier on the humans and the goats...it is over in a matter of seconds and the goats go on their merry way. You don't have to worry about cleaning up and disposing of the caustic goop and you don't have to worry about burning things that were not meant to be.
     
    Madgoat likes this.
  8. Mully

    Mully New Member

    408
    Jun 23, 2009
    Mt Ulla , NC
    Not good ....stay away from voodoo medicine.
     
  9. crocee

    crocee New Member

    Jul 25, 2008
    Northeast Arkansas
    This would be akin to putting a lye paste on YOUR head. Its very caustic and causes severe burns.
     
  10. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    but in that same token crocee disbudding with an iron is like putting a hot iron on your skin -- OUCH

    I think it can be used effectively but since I have never used it I cant say that I would or wouldnt use it.

    Since Keren has had success with it maybe when she returns and has time she can post more about its use, effectiveness and more of a "how to"
     
    Annieday likes this.
  11. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    thanks stacey

    these are the directions on the Dr Naylor product

    They are just a touch different to what I do, as I have used a different brand name of the same type of product.

    Basically I do it as soon as you can feel horn buds, up to 1 wk old for goaties (standard size) and up to 1 mth old for calfies.

    I dont trim the hair I just part it so I get the paste right down on the skin

    I use a wooden 'paddle pop' stick, or a tongue depresser. You know like the doctor puts in your mouth and tells you to say 'ahhhh'. No idea what you call them over there.

    Well I put the paste on the wooden stick, make sure you wear gloves btw, and smear a little paste over the horn bud. Dont go overboard putting it on, a little goes a long way.

    Once its on, wipe the stick in the dirt to deactivate it.

    Then, I put duct tape over the horn buds and around the animal's head - kinda like a big bandage all the way round. It looks ridiculous but it serves two purposes. One, if mama cow/goat licks baby's head, she doesnt get the paste in her mouth potentially causing a nasty and painful situation. And two the kid/calf cant rub it off before it does its job, potentially causing scurs.

    With calves they go back out to the paddock, I dont bother removing the duct tape it falls off by itself eventually. With kids I take it off after 3 or 4 days.

    I have heard all the horror stories about it burning holes in animal's heads ...

    But I was taught to do it by someone who has always done it her whole life, and never had a problem. And I havent had a problem either.

    I think if you do it correctly its safe. Similarly, if you disbud with an electric or hot iron, it can be dangerous if you dont do it right. But if you do it correctly its safe.
     
    Madgoat likes this.
  12. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    So you dont remove it like the product bottle suggests?
     
  13. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    no I dont - but that might be necessary with the Dr Naylors brand, I just dont know.

    sorry
     
  14. firelight27

    firelight27 Hopelessly Addicted

    Apr 24, 2009
    Southern Oregon
    What brand did you use Keren? I've heard of people using Dr. Larson's and seemingly having better luck...but most seem to keep it on for a few days. It seems like it doesn't cause the kids much actual discomfort from the stories I have heard...that they don't seem to notice. It also seems that some people use tricks to keep it from rubbing/leaking such as making vasoline circles so the paste won't run beyond it, and the duct tape idea. Most people say you just have to leave it on long enough, and be careful to avoid the caustic from getting anywhere it shouldn't be. In other words, it won't get on mom, or in its eyes if you take the time to hold the kid the entire time period you are supposed to leave it on...and by using the duct tape.

    In any case, has anyone used any of the pastes and actually followed the correct timing directions? (30 minutes?) I wonder if that is too little an amount of time?

    I launched into continued study after Keren's story, and have found people arguing from both sides of the fence. It seems that people who use it on calves love it, and say the calves never even act bothered.
     
  15. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    well colour me red faced - I thought we had the Hornex brand, but I just went out and double checked and guess what it is actually Dr Naylors :oops: :oops: :oops:

    I think we've used the hornex stuff in the past too, I think its much of a muchness

    yes, the animals dont seem to really express any pain or discomfort
     
  16. FunnyRiverFarm

    FunnyRiverFarm New Member

    Sep 13, 2008
    Hudson, MI
    I kind of get the feeling that goats do not have a whole lot of nerve endings on the tops of their heads...makes sense when you think of what they use their heads for.

    Even when using the iron, the kids seem to be more upset about being restrained than they are about being burned.
     
  17. bheila

    bheila New Member

    644
    Jan 9, 2009
    Kent, Wa
    I've only used it once and it was on a calf 3 years ago....didn't work. He DID NOT like it. It was obvious it was burning his head.
     
  18. firelight27

    firelight27 Hopelessly Addicted

    Apr 24, 2009
    Southern Oregon
    So Keren. You leave Dr. Naylor's on for 3-4 days? Do you think it will not work if left on for the instructed time?
     
  19. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    I have absolutely no idea. Thats just how I was taught :) Only one way to find out and thats try it and see ... you can always band the horns/scurs if it doesnt work ...
     
  20. firelight27

    firelight27 Hopelessly Addicted

    Apr 24, 2009
    Southern Oregon
    Hmmm. Thanks for the info. I think I'll go ahead with the iron. I just am too afraid of ending up with scurs...or getting the acid where it shouldn't be. Knowing me I'd drip it on my arm and then my arm would fall off.