Feeding & caring for new kids

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by odieclark, Jul 29, 2017.

  1. Allow them to nurse on mom

    31 vote(s)
    100.0%
  2. Take kids away from mom

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Start the kids on creep at 1-3 weeks

    7 vote(s)
    22.6%
  4. Sell kids at one day

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Allow kids to birth on pasture

    7 vote(s)
    22.6%
  6. Use kidding pens for birthing

    18 vote(s)
    58.1%
  7. Use kidding pens for first time moms to bond with kids

    8 vote(s)
    25.8%
  8. We feed extra whole milk to add weight on new kids

    1 vote(s)
    3.2%
  9. Other ideas-!

    3 vote(s)
    9.7%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    I found old posts on here regarding feeding new goat kids, but as they are old threads am starting a new one!

    Quick background
    At the farm we have had 5 goats kid twins, with one set of triplets. We have 3 others who also may kid, but did not yet. We did not run pregnancy tests, so aren't sure the remainder are bred, but we have time for that yet... so, the kids have arrived beginning mid July, and are spaced over a two week time span so far. With that, we have various birth weights of 5.5-9.5 pounds, of predominantly a boer goat breed. All seem healthy, gave 0.5 Bo-se shot to kids and are allowing them time with. mom. We have put the first time to kid does in kidding pens hoping for them to learn what to do and bond with their kids. Also, the triplets were moved to a larger pen to bond with the 3. All kidded on pasture or inside, as they can go in and out...

    So,..as we can monitor weight gain, have questions for all of you!

    -1. When do you begin creep feed! What age and how much?
    2. Do you give unlimited creep? What age?
    3. When do you give CDT?
    4. Do you give CDT before creep? Banding or castration?
    5. Do you give kids Replamin? Pro-bios? Selenium-e gel? B-12?
    6. Do you supplement triplets with bottles? Can a doe produce enough milk for 3?
    7. Anysuggestions for does who have triplets for feeding or getting more weight on the kids?
    8. One doe goat had twins of about a 3 pound difference! Is there anything we can do to get them closer in size, or to assist in getting the smaller one to gain?

    Thank you!
     
    capracreek likes this.
  2. Suzanne_Tyler

    Suzanne_Tyler GreenTGoats

    Jul 19, 2014
    US
    I don't creep feed. Kids get free choice alfalfa hay along with the rest of the herd. At 2 weeks old they start getting separated from their dams at night so I can milk in the morning. I give them on about 1/3 lb grain per kid at night.

    See above.

    I don't give CDT. I do give tetanus antitoxin before disbudding.

    See above on CDT.

    I don't give them anything for tetanus when I band them, but sometimes if it looks a bit iffy I spray iodine on.

    I give weak kids and kids with weak legs selenium/e gel. I have BoSe on hand for emergencies, but have not had to use it for the kids yet.

    I've only had triplets once, and I did not supplement them. The bigger two did fine, but the runt was kind of lagging. When the kids started getting locked up at night at 2 weeks old, I left him out with the dam by himself. That caught him up to the other two pretty quick. I'm definitely going to supplement future trips.

    Make sure the dam is getting excellent nutrition so she can support them, and supplement kids as needed.

    Really isn't much you can do to prevent it from happening. You could supplement the smaller one if you wanted, but I probably wouldn't.
     
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  3. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
  4. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    This is one of the triplets in photo above. Brown and it looks like someone spilled white paint all over him! He is the smallest and most difficult so far, to gain weight! His sister, also is smaller. The one male is larger and seems to be the most aggressive at nursing. So far, we have given momma just about everything we can think of, one item mixed in at a time...
    Lots of fresh water
    Water with a bit of molasses in it
    her regular grain mixture with added:
    -Beet pulp
    -molasses
    -Calf manner Starter/manna pro brand
    -Sea kelp

    Allowing her to eat her grain free choice along with her hay and water!

    Still having a challenge with this guy in keeping his weight Actually all of the triplets are tough to keep weights up..., or getting them to go up much from their:storkboy::storkboy::storkgirl: birth weights.

    They are just a week old! :hbd:

    Any ideas? :2c: Anyone?

    :eek:
     
    capracreek likes this.
  5. Suzanne_Tyler

    Suzanne_Tyler GreenTGoats

    Jul 19, 2014
    US
    Don't give molasses. It slows growth and inhibits nutrient absorption.
     
    capracreek likes this.
  6. I only give molasses with water right after kidding. I do give sweet feed on the stand. I'm still researching molasses as far as nutrient binding. I like the mill I buy from and I know some places use molasses to make sub par ingredients more palatable. I find my does are doing quite well in both health and condition.

    I give Replamin gel once a month and Sweetlix minerals free choice. I also copper bolus twice a year.

    Sent from my XT1635-01 using Goat Forum mobile app
     
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  7. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    So, don't use molasses in water? Or not on feed/grain?

    I do like the idea of mixing in alfalfa hay with the does regular hay gradually. They do love it! Just want to not go to quickly to upset their rumen!
     
    capracreek likes this.
  8. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    I'd be offering a bottle to the kids. Stop the molasses. I'd also give mom a rumen bolus.
     
  9. Suzanne_Tyler

    Suzanne_Tyler GreenTGoats

    Jul 19, 2014
    US
    Don't do either.
     
    capracreek and goatblessings like this.
  10. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    Great, thanks Karen, Suzanne, and all the others for the replies and for NO MORE MOLASSES! Ok!

    What is a Rumen Bolus? Do you think the triplets momma has an upset stomach or just not being very effective in feeding 3? This is her first time as a mom, and 3! I will have to see if we can get it locally or if it is necessary to order it. Is there an alternative if we would have to order it and wait for it? Perhaps baking soda or something? She does like to eat, and we have began to give her alfalfa hay with her more grassy hay.
     
  11. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    :bookgoat:Momma, Female, and paint spilled male IMG_4346.JPG We have offered bottles, and are still trying to give them a bottle every day. They are very stubborn and they reject the bottle. We have had to truly force them to get an ounce of whole milk down them. Even stripped the same from momma and still they refuse, Trying everything and willing to try nearly anything! The two smallest, shown in first photo and the one attached here of the female, are the two who have struggled to add weight.

    They are 8 days old.
    Brown male has gained 1/2 pound
    Dark headed female has gained about 1/3 of a pound
    Brown headed male has gained 2.5 pounds:mrgoat:

    IDEAS?:buttheads:
     
    capracreek likes this.
  12. Suzanne_Tyler

    Suzanne_Tyler GreenTGoats

    Jul 19, 2014
    US
    Rumen boluses are yeast caps that aid rumen health. I think some TSCs carry them, but not sure. You'd have to check with yours.

    To get them to drink from a bottle.
    - Put a hand or towel over their eyes while offering them the nipple
    - Use a Prichard nipple
    - Squeeze the back of their neck to make them scream and then shove the nipple in
     
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  13. I put my hand over their eyes, take my thumb and forefinger to pry their mouth open and pop the nipple in. I also make sure the milk is nice and warm.

    Sent from my XT1635-01 using Goat Forum mobile app
     
    capracreek likes this.
  14. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Are you saying that is what they gained in 8 days?
     
  15. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    We tried covering their eyes, flicking their little tails-which did help some, had them stand with neck outstretched,..didn't do the neck pinch-but we have gotten them to scream! Momma doesn't take well to the screaming!

    We can try the other nipples, but went back to the baby bottle ones that our other kids preferred.

    We have tried warm. And room temp,...
     
    capracreek likes this.
  16. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    Karen, yes total gain for 8 days. So, for example at birth6.5 pounds and 8 days later only 7 pounds
     
    capracreek likes this.
  17. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    Suzanne, you said "Rumen boluses are yeast caps that aid rumen health. I think some TSCs carry them, but not sure. You'd have to check with yours. "

    Are you saying our does rumen is the issue? How do we know this? She seems to be herself?

    Two of the 3 triplets have not really gained any weight. We have tracked all of our kids weights from birth.

    One goat who is small, and had twins has averaged about 1/4 pound gain on average over eleven days.
    Our other 3, all who had twins that also kidded recently, are averaging about a half pound per day average. ADG.

    The last one to birth, for their first 5 days has one averaging just over a half pound per day and the other twin about 3/4 pound per day. One began at only 6.4, and her twin was 8.4 at birth.
     
    capracreek likes this.
  18. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

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  19. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    Thanks everyone! I just called the vet near us and they have these rumen boluses / a similar product to your link. As they are for calves, she still felt they would be good for the goat and stimulate her rumen.

    Hoping to get these picked up this morning and give one to her asap! Keeping my fingers crossed this helps get her going and the kids going and gaining! I know they can't continue on much longer like this...just not normal to not be gaining!

    Do you think we should also give one to our small goat/doe who has kids gaining only about 1/4 pound daily, or is that an acceptable gain rate. Mainly worried about her, as she is a smaller goat than any of our other adult does, basically not the best confirmation overall. She is very protective of her twins, and is attentive to them, but just don't know what to expect of her. The other 3 who had kids are all gaining about 1/2 to 3/4 pounds per day on average, so they all seem fine.
     
  20. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Do one whole bolus once a day for 3 days. Do both girls. Won't hurt and can only help. I just dump the powder in their mouth but you can also mix in water and syringe.

    You are still going to need to address that poor weight gain on all those kids. I don't consider 1/4 lb per day ok.

    I've always had good luck with Pritchard nipples. Make sure the milk is really warm.
     
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