growing boys & copper/selenium

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by cnoel, Oct 6, 2017.

  1. cnoel

    cnoel New Member

    24
    Apr 3, 2017
    SELENIUM:

    5 months ago, I gave our 3 month old boys a BoSe, standard dose according to their weight at the time. All were in need, a few were exceptionally deficient- their front legs were bent like a lounge chair. After BoSe, everything straightened out!

    They’re 8 months old now and have tripled in size. I’ve noticed that one in particular seems weak in the legs and, after researching, learned that his bent tail (see photo) is a symptom of selenium deficiency also. I’m wondering if I should (A) give all of them another BoSe, or just give if I see something concerning and (B) if I should give full dose (determined by current weight)??

    COPPER:

    Gave the kid-sized bolus at the end of July (they were at the upper weight bracket for the kid-sized bolus then) and they have grown quite a bit since. Recently, their coloring has been regressing and they have fishtails back worse than before. Should
     
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  2. cnoel

    cnoel New Member

    24
    Apr 3, 2017
    Whoops!! Posted before finishing!

    *Should I give another full kid bolus? Is this likely due to their growth and increased need?
     
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  3. cnoel

    cnoel New Member

    24
    Apr 3, 2017
  4. Suzanne_Tyler

    Suzanne_Tyler GreenTGoats

    Jul 19, 2014
    NC
    I would give the one pictured selenium and give everyone copper. Might be a good idea to up the dose to 1.5 kid capsules.
     
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  5. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    Hmm

    Update us in a few weeks!
     
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  6. mariarose

    mariarose Well-Known Member

    Oct 23, 2014
    SouthCentralKY, USA
    It sounds like copper and selenium is going to be an ongoing issue with you. It is for a lot of people. Including me. Be prepared to dose more frequently than some other people do.

    Some here have had good luck using Replamin Plus Gel as a way of getting over a deficiency problem. I've not used it, but I hear good things.

    May I ask what loose minerals you give? Some mineral mixes are higher in those two minerals than other mixes are. They aren't created equal.

    If you are not giving loose minerals, then you need to. We can help with sorting out your choices if you need us.
     
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  7. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    I agree with what has been said.

    Are you giving loose salt and minerals free choice with copper and selenium in it? Not the block, it does no good.
     
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  8. cnoel

    cnoel New Member

    24
    Apr 3, 2017
    Thank you all for responding!!

    I bolused all of them yesterday and, additionally, gave Hercules (tail pictured above) a 1/2 BoSe. My nerves held me back from giving him the full dose, but I’ll be monitoring his progress the next couple weeks to determine if he needs more- also watching the others to be sure they aren’t deficient as well.

    So far- it’s only been one day and we could already see an improvement in Herc’s energy and posture (same thing happened when we dosed him 5 months ago)!!

    I do uuuuusually have Manna Pro Minerals with kelp and nutritional yeast mixed in available to them, but I just learned that my bf did not have them out the past month when I was gone. Apparently, the bright orange sticky note that read “keep minerals STOCKED inside barn” on the pitcher of their mix wasn’t clear enough instructions- ugh!
     
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  9. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    No minerals, that is what happened.
    Sorry they weren't given them, while you were gone.
    I guess when we want something done right, we have to do it ourselves. ;) :)
    Glad there is improvement already, good job. :)
     
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  10. cnoel

    cnoel New Member

    24
    Apr 3, 2017
    Crazy that it can impact them that drastically in such a short period of time!!
     
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  11. mariarose

    mariarose Well-Known Member

    Oct 23, 2014
    SouthCentralKY, USA
    Yeah, the difference can be startling. They really need it, and I'm glad you have the minerals out again. But that particular mineral mix may not be enough to overcome the shortfall, so keep an eye out to see if you need another infusion of both of those minerals.

    I'm sure your bf will know better from now on with this graphic demonstration!

    You've done great sorting this out.
     
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  12. odieclark

    odieclark Well-Known Member

    Jan 21, 2016
    Mana pro goat minerals, loose minerals. They have a nifty dispenser and they like the minerals. 24/7!
     
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  13. mariarose

    mariarose Well-Known Member

    Oct 23, 2014
    SouthCentralKY, USA
    Yes, odieclark, we know how careful you are about this! The OP here uses Manna Pro minerals like you do.
     
  14. cnoel

    cnoel New Member

    24
    Apr 3, 2017
    Yep yep!! The minerals are out, and they are quite pleased about that.

    But, of course, I’m concerned about one of the other bucklings. His horns seem to be brittle. He’s tall, big horns, very strong, dominant personality, and (as you’d expect) has been dueling with the herd leaders lately (we have one pygmy and one alpine that function as a team to run the herd- it’s adorable). The other day, we noticed that one horn was chipped a little more than halfway up. Tonight, I saw a small amount of blood on his head and the outer layer cracked all the way around, about an inch up from the base on the other horn.

    I separated him for now. Luckily the vet is coming in the morning to neuter him and the other young boys, but he is multispecies- can help with splinting, but not with mineral knowledge. SOOOO, I turn to you amazingly helpful goat people- is this another symptom of selenium deficiency? Should he be getting a BoSe also? I’m starting to strongly consider this Replamin Plus Gel you mentioned, mariarose!!
     
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  15. nancy d

    nancy d Moderator

    Oct 5, 2007
    near Seattle
    What's this guy's age? Horns do peel & flake while young but really there shouldn't be blood, he must be pretty dominant. Getting him neutered will simmer him down. BoSe won't hurt him at all when dosed at 1 cc per 40 lbs.
     
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  16. mariarose

    mariarose Well-Known Member

    Oct 23, 2014
    SouthCentralKY, USA
    As I've said, I've never used it. I've read good things about how it gets a goat over a deficiency by giving once a week. One person I read said she gave 2 days in a row, then once a week, but I have no idea how bad her goat was.

    Here is the guaranteed analysis

    https://www.drugs.com/vet/maac-replamin-gel-plus.html
     
  17. cnoel

    cnoel New Member

    24
    Apr 3, 2017
    Thank you for the info, mariarose!

    Nancy- he is about 7 months old. It’s funny, because a few of the bucklings started challenging the the two alphas over a month ago. The alphas handled it well, no injuries, all bonded and play together often now. But with Crisco (goat with horn injury)- the alphas actually sought him out and have been the ones challenging him. He does engage (and oh boy, the way he hits even intimidates me!), but very rarely does he initiate anything with them. They act very stern when they battle with him, too- never playing.
     
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  18. nancy d

    nancy d Moderator

    Oct 5, 2007
    near Seattle
    Cnoel that age is well within the peeling/flaking range.
     
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