help...abscess on doe's jaw

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by Froggy, Mar 20, 2011.

  1. Froggy

    Froggy New Member

    127
    Feb 26, 2011
    just this morning when I went out to give my 4 preggy does grain, I noticed my 3yo (130day pregnant)nigi/pygmy cross doe had a round, firm ''ball'' between her neck & her jaw, if that makes sense...it's got a scab on it too... :sigh:

    I am kinda freaking out right now because my wether is losing weight, and I'm gonna have to do a fecal on him, and I've got a doe due in the next 5days, and this is the 2ND time I've had an abscess in a year (last time it was in the summer, with a different doe. I figured she had scratched her self on the fence when she escaped)
    Now I'm worried that the lump is CL.... :(

    and I'm afraid because these goats are my pets & responsibility...and I don't want to have sick goats.... :sigh:
     
  2. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Well your best bet is to put her in a pen away from other goats but if it is CL and you have had other goats with abscess then its likely they are contaminated already. If you separate her or not I recommend you lance it and send some of the gunk to a testing lab. UC Davis or WADDL and have the gunk tested to see exactly what it is.
     

  3. myfainters

    myfainters New Member

    Oct 29, 2009
    Lancaster, CA
    Agreed. Sorry...hopefully she just has a splinter or something...but never just assume that is the problem. Test so you know for sure and don't have to worry about it. Too much stress not knowing. :hug:
     
  4. Froggy

    Froggy New Member

    127
    Feb 26, 2011
    ...this is really distressing...
    I have...A lot of questions:
    Can I get a test done through a vet? Is it more expensive that way?
    Should I test all my goats for it, or only a couple?
    Does the ground/area stay infected should an abscess burst? If so, how long?

    and I hate this part.... (if they're positive) would I be better off culling (butchering) them?
    I've decided I will not be keeping any of their kids, and I was gonna cull this doe anyway...soo...
    Is it safe to eat the meat of a CL positive goat?

    thanks for your input,

    Froggy
     
  5. So sorry for your distress. Can you post a picture of the abscess. I had a doe that got an abscess on her head where I figured there was supposed to be a lymph node. It was like a big red blood blister and it didn't really ooze when it burst; it just seemed to bleed a little. I had it tested for CL anyways. Turned out negative (thankfully). All I did was talk to the vet and he sent me home with a swab kit to take a sample of the exudate. The test was about $65 with all the taxes and courier fees.
     
  6. liz

    liz Well-Known Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    IF it is CL...The property in which the infected animals are penned will stay infected for a very long time, not knowing when a possible Cl abcess has burst and contaminated fencing, housing, feeders etc increases the risk for herdmates to contract it.

    It would be best to separate her and either have a vet out to lance and clean the abcess aseptically or you can do it yourself and have the gunk from it tested.
    As far as eating CL positive goats, IDK the answer to that, I do know that it is contageous to humans and is called by a different name, so if you do decide to do the lancing yourself, be sure to wear gloves.
     
  7. Bellafire Farm

    Bellafire Farm New Member

    810
    Jan 5, 2010
    NW Oregon
    I'm not sure were your located... but we have done our testing (including an abscess years ago lanced & sent by the vet for $$$$) thru WADDL, Washington State University Veterinary College - their # is 509-335-9696. And here is a link to their pages: http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/depts_waddl/fees.aspx

    Our abscess scare turned out to be a splinter w/Staph infection....so don't completely sell yourself on CL...it could possibly be something treatable.
    I believe the CL test is about $9.00 w/a $10 accession fee... and we've always had ours get there promptly by using USPS Priority mail w/an iced gel pack (small flat rate box for $4.95), otherwise if your further away you could overnight it.

    It would be best to call them first thing Monday morning and ask if it's alright for you to use a syringe/18 or 16 gauge needle to CAREFULLY drain out the abscess & send it to them for testing (CL and/or culture)...It would be MUCH MUCH cheaper to do it yourself, and they have always been great about me doing everything myself and sending it to them personally, so they should be just fine w/it. You can also find out when to expect your results, and request that they call you or email you or fax you w/results. Be sure to ask them what you should put the sample in... many times they just tell me to double enclose it in two Ziploc bags...I think the abscess got mailed in a red-top tube simply because we had some onhand, but I'm sure they'll let you know what you need to do. They are GREAT people up there...super helpful and understanding.

    PS - !!! DEFINITELY TREAT THIS AS HIGHLY CONTAGIOUS TO ANIMALS & PEOPLE !!! Whether it's Staph or CL, both are HIGHLY contagious and will absolutely wreak havoc! Wear gloves, coveralls or overclothes of somekind, put your hair back, have lots of disposable paper towels in case it ruptures...also Nolvasan is an excellent Veterinary grade disinfectant that kills staph & can be used on wounds/sores/abscess' (there is also a knockoff brand containing the main ingredient but I can remember it off hand - chlorhexadine maybe??? - ... so once you get it drained then cover the sore thoroughly w/some Nolvasan... just dont get it in the eyes or nose. Be very careful once your done w/the lancing that you DO NOT touch anything or let any yucky stuff get on the ground or bedding.... be careful of opening fences, doors, other animals or people coming up to you... your clothing & everything will have this bacteria on it, so put them straight in the hot/warm wash water & dry thoroughly on high. Washing in warm or hot water, and especially drying on high will kill Staph.
    Just wanting to warn you how contagious this stuff is... very yucky! :sigh:
    Good luck... :) I'm hoping it's just some nasty Staph they picked up somewhere...and you can work through that... :)
     
  8. Froggy

    Froggy New Member

    127
    Feb 26, 2011
    first we called the vet...but he hasn't gotten back to us yet, and I was afraid the abscess would burst before he got there.
    soo....we lanced it & flushed it with h.peroxide. disgusting. :sick: I tried my best to clean the area w/bleach & stuff...
    then my mom called a friend of ours who is an experienced goat-raiser. After my mom described just how the stuff looked, she is like 99% sure it is CL (pus w/a cheesy consistency). Then she said what we did was fine, and that she's had cases of CL, but has kept the goats for milk anyway. She told us to keep that doe away from the others till the cut healed.

    What do you think we should do now? I know for certain that I've got 2 goats w/CL. All 4 of my goats are pregnant, due soon, and I'm wondering...will the babies have it too? or will they only get it if they nurse, sorta like CAE?

    I guess on thing is for sure---I am NOT selling any goats.
     
  9. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    You need to use Iodine/water...make it into a light tea... is best to use to flush the wound....Peroxide doesn't do any good.... Bleaching was a good thing..... :wink:

    With CL ...all the herd can be at risk..... if it gets into the ground...or on anything...that the other goats are exposed to... confining the animal away from the herd and not letting anything in where she was.......proper clean up and disposing of the yuck....does help... but it isn't a 100% guarantee that no one will get it... :( :hug:
     
  10. Froggy

    Froggy New Member

    127
    Feb 26, 2011
    the vet got back to us...he's coming out on Wednesday....to check things out. We've tied the affected doe away from the others, so...maybe...still, I'm 75% sure everyone has it already.
    Turns out the thing my wether has may be a lot more serious than we thought.

    this just sucks.... :cry:
     
  11. Bellafire Farm

    Bellafire Farm New Member

    810
    Jan 5, 2010
    NW Oregon
    Again... You don't know FOR SURE that you have CL.... the Staph infection stuff is thick, creamy, light colored "cottage cheesy" looking stuff too. Do you have any of the 'goop' that you can still send to WADLL? Or take it to your vet and tell them to test it/send it off to be tested? It doesn't take much at all.
    You also have to understand that dealing with & talking about CL with goat people is A LOT like talking Politics... everyone has their own opinions... many people are A-O.k. with keeping CL goats...many people are absolutely NOT o.k with keeping CL goats. So it really depends on who you're talking to & understanding that they will have their own opinion on what you should do. You will then have to decide whether you want to maintain a CL animal (go thru the +'s/-'s of that decision) and determine what your own stand on CL is. A CL positive animal will develop abscess INSIDE & out...so just because you don't see them doesn't mean the animal is unharmed/uninfected. Also CL will get into the ground and continue to infect others. And do you want to drink milk from an infected animal? I dont even drink/keep the milk from any of my girls when they have the sniffles...but that's just my opinion/choice. I'm a bit of a germaphobe :roll: .... but others are completely different and that's ok. You just need to figure out where YOU stand. It's a tough decision...but once you figure that out you'll know exactly what to do from that point on. ALSO - definitely get them tested BEFORE you make any harsh decision...I still believe there is a chance that it's NOT CL...and I'm sure you want to give your goaties every chance possible. :wink:
    Good luck.
     
  12. Bellafire Farm

    Bellafire Farm New Member

    810
    Jan 5, 2010
    NW Oregon
    oops, we posted together...
    Great news that the vet is coming out! If you can take a goatie or two IN to him, it will save you the travel charge costs... but I'm not sure if that's an option for you... I just know that everyone is financially struggling, so I thought I'd throw that out there for you, just incase....
    :hug: Having faith & hoping for a good outcome for you...
     
  13. Froggy

    Froggy New Member

    127
    Feb 26, 2011
    I'll certainly try to keep positive. We'll see after the vet comes...what he thinks.I'm sure he'll have advice on what we should do, or whatever...maybe he'll go ahead and test the stuff we collected... Luckily he is a traveling vet, so I don't think there will be extra fees...
    I'm mainly concerned about eating meat & drinking milk of the affected animals...because that was the whole point of the goats...

    this is the most wonderful birthday present ever... :GAAH:
     
  14. Timothy Hay

    Timothy Hay New Member

    35
    Feb 11, 2011
    we have had CL for about 3 years now and my mom and dad butchered 3 of are pygmy wethers who had CL and everyone ate one of those 3 my mom talked to a lot of vets about this and they said it was fine it mainly effects the lyph nodes and the lungs so the meat is fine..