just separated mom and kids for the night for the first time

Discussion in 'Kidding Koral' started by chiara, Jul 9, 2010.

  1. chiara

    chiara New Member

    50
    Nov 21, 2009
    portland, or
    ... how long should i expect the yelling to continue? mom and babies are very upset. they're 3 weeks old today, have hay and water and a nice stall to sleep in. mom is yelling, they're yelling, and every time they quiet down for a minute, someone makes a noise and that sets them all off again. mom has another doe with her, so no one's alone. is there any way I can make this transition easier? I really want to start getting a little more milk out of her, hence the separation. Thanks!!
     
  2. liz

    liz Well-Known Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    It does take a few days of being consistent with separating...what works well for me is that I feed the kids their grain in the chosen stall in the am and when fed again in the pm I shut the gate for "nite nite", my babies can see their moms through the slats but once the light is out they bed down, once they're in a routine it will be easier.
     

  3. chiara

    chiara New Member

    50
    Nov 21, 2009
    portland, or
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    thanks for the ideas. with my setup the kids are in the "barn" and the does are outside in their shelter/pen. I only have the one stall. i'm in the city, so a pretty small setup. do you think it would be better to get a large dog crate into the pen and put them in there for the night so everyone can still see each other? or just keep with this system? in a another month my other doe is due to kid so i'll potentially need the indoor stall for her and her babies ...
     
  4. liz

    liz Well-Known Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    I believe Stacey uses a dog crate with success, Try it and see, I think that once they know that mom is still there they'll settle down fine.
     
  5. chiara

    chiara New Member

    50
    Nov 21, 2009
    portland, or
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    well, i set up the wire dog crate inside the shelter. babies were asleep by the time i made it out there, but mom was still screaming (had yelled herself hoarse, poor thing). put babies inside, and everything was pretty instantaneously quiet. hopefully mom won't tear the thing down during the night. i got about 5 million mosquito bites in then 10 minutes i was out there, though. yeouch!
     
  6. liz

    liz Well-Known Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    What breed? You'll have to post on how much you got from mama, be warned though, the first time milking, moms tend to not want to give YOU the milk meant for their babies, I normally just about empty my girls, leaving just enough for the kids breakfast and you'll be amazed at how fast those little boogers attack those teats!
     
  7. chiara

    chiara New Member

    50
    Nov 21, 2009
    portland, or
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    she's a minimancha. i've been getting 3/4 - 1 cup every morning with the kids on her, she's a FF with triplets. she's getting better on the stand, but i still have to use a hobble. she's also the first mini i've milked, so my newbieness with the smaller teats can't be too helpful. i'll post again and let you guys know if there is a marked increase in her output. good to know not to milk her out completely ... she already seems to be getting kind of stingy with the kids, walking away a lot when they try to nurse during the day.
     
  8. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    believe me even if you think mom isnt letting them nurse much - they are! Years of raising goats has shown me that the kids nurse faster AND the mom will call them over only when i am not around and she will stand let them nurse while she chews her cud. Ive witnessed this by "accident" when i was hidden from view.
     
  9. chiara

    chiara New Member

    50
    Nov 21, 2009
    portland, or
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    well. i got 2 1/2 cups from her this morning. Yay!! didn't nearly empty her out, leaving some for the babes, and she's SO jumpy on the stand! It's driving me crazy. she gets up there willingly enough, but then loses it randomly and repeatedly. she was kicking, so i got a hobble, and now she bucks and i have to get the bucket out of the way super fast or lose everything. plus it's obvious she's totally freaked out, which makes me feel awful. i had to put the stand against a wall because she was bucking so hard she would buck her entire body off the stand. don't get me wrong, it's better than the first day we did it, but not by much. I've been milking her daily for about a week, maybe a little longer. grrrr. super frustrated, and getting a backache! if anyone has tips, I'd be super appreciative! how long until she calms down? will she ever calm down? her mom is a breeze on the stand. not fair.
     
  10. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    can you tie her legs to the stand? I never liked the hobble idea, just seems like it would only make the problem worse.

    Also I give them a good smack when they are jumpy like that - not good milking stand manors and they need to learn that it will NOT be tolerated!

    Are you feeding her when on the milking stand?
     
  11. chiara

    chiara New Member

    50
    Nov 21, 2009
    portland, or
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    the stand is where she gets her morning grain.

    so giving her a good smack is ok? I've been working so hard to hide my frustration from her so i don't freak her out more. maybe i'm being too much of a softie!

    do you mean tying her by the ankles to the stand? so she can't jump?
     
  12. farmergal

    farmergal New Member

    519
    Jun 19, 2009
    Northern California
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    Hmmm... so she is definitely used to the milk stand? You said she gets her morning grain on the stand... but if you haven't been doing this for at least a week or two, I'd take a step back and just start introducing her to the milk stand with grain and that's it. My girls had a couple of weeks of only positive experiences (eating grain and yummy snacks) before I started trying to milk them. And at first I just got them used to having their udders touched, and milking out a stream or two, before really getting the bucket out and getting down to business.

    Does she give you any time until she starts freaking out? If she does, try stopping before she starts freaking out. Do this for a few days so that you have a few days of the "right" behavior. THEN start trying to push past her freak-out point... and again, if she just stops kicking and behaves for a little, consider that a success and let her go.

    Whatever you do... don't end on a bad note! Don't let them off the stand if they're misbehaving because that rewards them for being bad. Make them stand quietly and eat their grain, even if you're not able to milk them.

    *Note: this is my experience breaking in 4 FFs... this is what worked for me, and each goat was a little different in how long it took them, but they're all now nicely trained :) And I did try smacking them, but my girls just seemed to get angry and behave worse. (I swear, Tux, my favorite, looked at me with this expression that said "How DARE you!!" before going for the milk bucket with a vengeance.) A light smack, once they're trained, can remind them of their job if they're having a fidgety morning... but while they were learning it just seemed to stress them out. Just my experience -- all goats are different!
     
  13. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    well she should be getting grain while you milk her this will keep her busy while you milk

    and yes I give them a good whack and I say NO. Plus i dont stop milking when they act up - they learn that acting up wont stop me. Dont give in to her behavior.

    Yes tieing her actual legs to the stand. This worked for us on a problem goat.
     
  14. chiara

    chiara New Member

    50
    Nov 21, 2009
    portland, or
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    hi guys.

    well, i probably had close to a quart this morning ... before she spilled it. i thought things were going so well. but then she finished her grain before i was done milking, and she started bucking (with her legs tied down, i might add). I smacked her, said NO! and kept milking, but it never really got better. I'm giving her 2 1/2 cups grain and a cup of alfalfa pellets on the stand. she gobbles it down so fast there's no way i can finish milking before she's done eating. and then all hell breaks loose. I feel like crying, and it's only a little after 7. great way to start the day. guess i need to tie her down even tighter? p.s. the husband hobble works really well when the husband is awake at milking time. :roll: unfortunately, that's not working out so well.
     
  15. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    Have a smaller bucket/container you milk into and then dump it into a larger bucket/container as you go along so if she does act up you dont loose it all :)
     
  16. liz

    liz Well-Known Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    Re: just separated mom and kids for the night for the first

    I have a grain gobbler too..a FF that thinks it's ok to move before I'm finished, my girl is likely much smaller than yours but what I have done was grab her leg nearest me and hold it down hard while milking one handed...also, another trick that works is to get2- 3 smooth stones and put them in the feed pan on top of her grain, it makes her slow down and she has to eat around the stones if she wants food.

    The amount you have gotten from her sounds to be a decent amount, with everyday milkings she'll settle down and will give much more in the next few weeks.