lice and diarreah?

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by StaceyRosado, Jun 18, 2008.

  1. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    so can goats get diarreah from lice?
     
  2. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    Not that I know of... could it be a relapse of Cocci? Just guessing here. :shrug:
     

  3. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Tanzy was treated with Sulmet and now with corid treated water but started to have diarreah this morning. Tomorrow I am picking up albon from the vet. But of course it is costly and i wanted to make sure I was making the right assumption due to them all having lice :hair: so I thought I would ask of the possibilty.

    Still trying ot think of options other then getting the albon but ............. don't want to loose her either
     
  4. Muddy Creek Farm

    Muddy Creek Farm New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Keokuk, Iowa
    You know, right after Sulmet treatment on a kid of mine he started with Scours (it was a preventative treatment) I think it may have been too much for his system, so I gave him Fast Track gel and baking soda, pepto and he is feeling better, still watching him like a hawk though.
     
  5. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    You could run a fecal again before treating her so you know thats it. Unless it's cheaper to just treat. I know my vet charges and arm and leg for a fecal.

    I hope it turns out to be nothing. :hug:

    It could be from the Sulmet like Muddy Creek said. So much antibiotics/meds could be messing with her system.
     
  6. liz

    liz Active Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    Stacey, it could be the combination of the 2..Sulmet and Corid..that has caused the diarreah, I know you want to stay on top of the cocci and I don't blame you but having too many different things in the tummy will cause upsets...You already know this and maybe wait a day to see if she clears up before trying the Albon. :grouphug:
     
  7. enjoytheride

    enjoytheride New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Humboldt Co Ca
    Maybe some probiocs would be good- treatment with sulfa drugs and antibiotics can create imbalances in the gut flora. Can't hurt- may be a saver.
     
  8. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    diarreah changed in color -- it is now a light brownish yellow.

    She doesnt' have it all over her just in tiny spots but I saw her poop and ti was runny - kind of just squirted out of her.

    I wanted to get some of the poop but I can't find it anywhere :shrug: so she is only squirting out little bit at a time.

    Well I did syringe feed her some corid treated water this mroning and tonight.

    So tomorrow they get clean water (5 day treatment is done). And i will just make sure she stays hydrated and then see if the scours clear up on their own.

    I would give the fastrack but I ran out (thought i had some but I must have used it adn the new tube I bought I gave to someone). I have the jump start gel which I could use I think :scratch:

    I do have some probios and Nutri drench. Will try that too

    Besides the money (which really isn't a huge factor) I just am not SURE she has cocci with all that she has been treated with. I don't want to mess her up more because she has to much meds in her.

    Alright --- plenty to think on. Must go to bed and I am sure i will have a clearer head tomorrow

    Thanks guys
     
  9. whatknott

    whatknott New Member

    256
    Feb 22, 2008
    Pennsylvania
    I've had my share of coccidia problems in the past. One year, I was losing a lot of pymgy babies to it - they would die during the treatment, before the treatment, and after the treatment - very frustrating that year - and interestingly, my lambs (kept in same area) did not get the coccidia symptoms.
    I then started using Purina's lamb chow for all my sheep and goats at all ages - it has a coccidia preventative in it. It has really helped. I now mix it in with Purina's sheep and goat grain.
    this year my lambs started the diarrhea with all signs of coccidia, but my two pygmy babies never got it - really weird.
    I seldom use albon for coccidia - if you have a Purina dealer near you, you can buy sulfanox - you use it like corid - in the water or directly in the mouth. Since it gets so diluated in water, if you think you have an animal with it, give it full strength in the mouth to that animal - putting it in water is only good for preventative, not treatment. The dosage is the same as corid - I think it's 1cc/5 pounds (anyone know that ratio for sure?)
    If this doesn't help in a couple of days (assuming they have been wormed too), I also use pepto-bismal - all lambs that were really bad this year, within 3 days poop was back to normal.

    Cat flea powder works great on baby goats with lice. Or DE....
     
  10. susanne

    susanne New Member

    257
    Nov 12, 2007
  11. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Well the Corid did work for me. Sweet Pea my sr doe had diarreah and by yesterday (day 5 of treated water) she had berries. Each day I saw improvement so I knew it was working.

    The trick is to get them to drink it and to drink enough of it fast so it is a concentrated dose. I have 13 goats out there. There is no way I am drench each goat by mouth to treat them. So with another experienced persons advise I flavored the treated water with koolaid and they drank it down fast. Then the rest of the day they got clean untreated water. I repeated this for 5 days with good results.

    Tanzy seems to be fine today. Still haven't caught her yet to give her the fastrack and nutri drench but I will do that later on.

    It is strange how one year or for one goat one med will work but for another it won't. Hans died dispite getting the same treatment as Presto who recovered. So I know that if it doesnt work try somethign else but for now the Corid worked and I am happy.

    I also doubled the water treatment dosage. There is a prevenative dosage but I used the treatment dosage.

    Remember this was the vets advise and he treats goats in my area.
     
  12. kelebek

    kelebek New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    South Texas
    When I did my treatment for cocci back in January - their levels were not high, but I wanted to nip it early - I treated everyone with Albon. It was a 5 day treatment - but it worked fast and very well! Check on the "special site" and see if you can get Albon on their cheaper then at your vet.

    My vet said that you can put Albon in the water for preventative but she does not reccommend it and that just to do a fecal every 6 months or so. I can have fecals run for under 20.00.

    Just out of curiousity, why is everyone against Albon?
     
  13. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    I am not against Albon, I love it. Corid is what most people dislike - but I also found it to work. Vet said that if used properly it will not effect their Thamine levels to much to cause Polio.

    I think a lot of problems happen when you give corid just as the goat is dying anyway as their thamine is depleated so far already. Best to use Albon or Sulmet at that point. Just my oppion NOT at all scientific.
     
  14. enjoytheride

    enjoytheride New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Humboldt Co Ca
    I think that Cocci has two different ways of reproducig in the intestinal tract- one is that the parasite is hatched fron the egg and invades and destroys an intestinal cell then releases eggs- the other is a method where the parasite reproduces itself inside the cell asexually then the intestinal cell is ruptured to release lots of new parasites that invade more cells. I would think that this may account for some difference as it would seem to me that releasing new parasites directly into the intestine for immediate re-infection of additonal cells could cause such massive damage fast, that the kid is lost.
    I wonder if this is why most things seem to work sometimes vey fast while not at other times. I have no one to ask about this so I may be off the wall in my thinking.
    But I assume early treatment is critical because of this. I'm sure that I might treat without need sometimes but even doing fecals doesn't seem to be a sure method for determining the need to treat. Sometimes the by the time eggs are found, the infection could be wide spread.
     
  15. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    there is so much that isnt known even to those who "know" about this stuff.

    Most of the time we are just along for the ride (that is why I love your user name so much ;) )
     
  16. liz

    liz Active Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    I had used Albon for treatment with very good results. Now as for prevention...I had not done because I use the milk from my does. My vet told me to get Deccox (which is in Blue Seal Meat goat grower and also Lamb Finisher) and mix 5 pounds to 25 pounds of mineral and give freechoice from the time they hit 3 months of pregnancy til 6 weeks past freshening...leaving 2 weeks to get it out of their system before I wean and start milking for my use. I am going to be able to purchase from her so I won't need to worry about finding it and I plan on doing this because I really don't want to deal with coccidia again.

    Stacey, your post had questioned wether lice would cause diarreah...They won't but if you have treated them for lice the product you used may have caused the upset. I spray my goats every 2 weeks with permethrin and citronella and usually afterwards they get loose stools..I'm thinking that they are ingesting the spray when they bite at an itch..therefore causing the "cow pies" :shrug:
     
  17. enjoytheride

    enjoytheride New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Humboldt Co Ca
    I only do the preventative every 21 days on kids- my older goats seem to have much much less issue with cocci. But it seems to effect the kids so seriously.
     
  18. goathappy

    goathappy New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Illinois
    I use Sulmet for treating cocci(we use herbals for prevention) and I have noticed that after I give sulmet their stools get looser before they get better.

    You can give Jumpstart Gel if you don't have the other stuff. Give her 2.5 ccs once a day.

    From what I've heard, I've heard that Albon is not as effective as other cocci treatments. Then last time I went to a breeder friend(she is like a dictionary :) ) she said that her vet said that Albon can cause permanent damage to the rumen and that is why it should not be used. I personally have never used it so I have no idea. I always use Sulmet and it has worked for me.
     
  19. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    actualy liz I would have thought that IF i had treated her. But the soft stools were before she was treated for lice.

    She has fine stools now and I didn't even treat her with anythig. I gave her fastrack and some nutri drench just in case on Thursday. I am still watching her though with this heat I dont' wnat to me missing something. I checked her temp and it was normal
     
  20. liz

    liz Active Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    Wasn't sure if you had treated them for the lice and it is really great that she is making berries so it could have been just an upset, hope they all continue to thrive ...even thru the heat :)