Management Help

Discussion in 'Goat Management' started by GroundGoats, Feb 6, 2014.

  1. GroundGoats

    GroundGoats New Member

    140
    Sep 17, 2013
    So I feel like it's time to change a few things.
    Mainly the hay and minerals I feed out, the vaccinations I give, the general lack of secondary supplementing(i.e. boluses, mineral/vitamin injections, extra feed additives), the routine hoof care I give and their shelter situation.

    I'm having issues with mineral deficiencies, that's for certain. My ND doe gave birth to kids that obviously had a selenium/vit. E issue and I've lost some luster and depth of color in my ND's and my Angora crosses and have rusty spots.

    I trim hooves about every 3 weeks, sometimes every 2 weeks, sometimes every 4. Not more than 4 weeks between trimmings. I've been noticing a breakdown of inner hoof walls, cracking kind of, and a general softness, a slight smell but not horribly noticeable. I have a supreme sense of smell though, so it could just be nothing with the smell. It's been gradually progressing across the board. I trim parallel to the coronary band and I use a rasp and I try to keep their pen and she dry, so I don't think it's necessarily rampant foot rot. Just some softness and breakdown for some reason. :/

    Those are the two issues right now that I feel are linked and easiest to correct.
    I'm wondering if I should start incorporating a regular footbath for prevention/treatment of foot issues? Also, I've already asked about Onyx and Sweetlix, but are there any other mineral choices worth my time/money? And what about copper boluses or BoSe?

    I feel like the foot and mineral issues are most pertinent here, since if it's gets any worse it'll get right out of hand.
     
  2. Wild Hearts Ranch

    Wild Hearts Ranch www.wildheartsranch.org

    Dec 26, 2011
    Copper is supposed to improve foot health, so I'd try that first.

    Mine really like kelp meal although it's not as balanced as goat formulated minerals, so I've been mixing it with the Sweetlix to get them to eat both.
     

  3. nancy d

    nancy d Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    near Seattle
    The loose minerals you mention are excellent. I have found that if they aren't fresh & dry my girls wont touch them. So I go out every day with a pan of it.
    BoSe if you are def in your area. Most places are.
    As for feet, perpetual dampness is a factor.
    In the Pac NW we fight it constantly, feet having to be done every month as opposed to every 3 mos in dry climates.
     
  4. GroundGoats

    GroundGoats New Member

    140
    Sep 17, 2013
    I trim so much cuz it's always wet here. There's snow everywhere right now, but that just means Spring is wettest of all. The ENTIRE pasture floods in the spring. :(
    I live in the North NE.

    Copasure makes a goat/sheep bolus right? Is that my only option for a copper bolus?

    My goats love kelp.
    Love it so much I can't keep it out there!

    I've been thinking that putting in raised platforms for bedding spots might keep my fiber girls cleaner and may give them a better chance at staying dry. I add bedding whenever it's wet, but sometimes it floods under and soaks up through before I notice. It's awful.
    We're hopefully moving in the fall. We're planning on building up the area where the goats will spend the most time so that it drains properly.
    I like the size of their current shelter, but it's really just a 12x12 box with a door. I'm going to need something bigger, since I have kids now and have more coming, but I'm at a loss for how big to make it. I have 5 ND's and 2 Angora crosses. I want to separate my angora x's, separate my ND bucks and keep my ND does together.
    I really love cattle panels for dividers, we buy the 54"x16' ones and cut them to size.
    How much space should they have? They're only locked up in bad weather and barely spend any time in there in the spring, summer and fall, but in the winter barely leave.
     
  5. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Mix your kelp in with the mineral. I use Onyx and love it. But my area is very deficient in copper and selenium so I still have to supplement at least twice a year. Replamin Plus is another good supplement. My girls get 5 cc every other week.

    Certainly the wetness in your area will cause foot problems but lack of minerals will make it worse. I wouldn't change your trimming schedule.
     
  6. GroundGoats

    GroundGoats New Member

    140
    Sep 17, 2013
    I guess I will have to beg'n'beg my feed store to carry stuff for me to buy.

    Is Copasure my only option for a copper bolus?
    What does Replamin Plus have for a vitamin/mineral profile?
    I read on a thread on another forum about Replamin. The results were gorgeous!

    Zinc affects the hardness of the hoof, right?
    They have some flaky skin too.
     
  7. fishin816

    fishin816 Raising Nigerian Dwarf DAIRY Goats, registered wit

    Mar 4, 2011
    Southern Illinois
    I bought my boluses from UltraCruz supplements, I got a REALLY good deal on the boluses there. I got a selenium/vit E gel from UltraCruz as well, I have found their supplements are the best, and they dont cost much! But like we were talking on the other thread, if you cant get the onyx, Sweetlix meatmaker is your next option. You will see huge results on your herds overall health if they are on a good loose mineral, and they ar given mineral supplements. All that should clear up your mineral problems and your hoof problems!
     
  8. fishin816

    fishin816 Raising Nigerian Dwarf DAIRY Goats, registered wit

    Mar 4, 2011
    Southern Illinois
    Oh and you can just order the boluses and gels from ultracruz's website. But the loose mineral will have to be ordered through a feed store.
     
  9. GroundGoats

    GroundGoats New Member

    140
    Sep 17, 2013
    Awesome!
    I hope my store carries Sweetlix already.
    Dunno why I've never asked.
     
  10. fishin816

    fishin816 Raising Nigerian Dwarf DAIRY Goats, registered wit

    Mar 4, 2011
    Southern Illinois
    Some stores don't carry Sweetlix, so it might have it ordered. Oh and if you can't get Sweetlix, MannaPro is another good loose mineral. I would prefer Sweetlix but Mannapro is good if you cant get Sweetlix. Many stores carry regularly stock manna pro.
     
  11. GroundGoats

    GroundGoats New Member

    140
    Sep 17, 2013
    I tried MannaPro, they didn't really care for it. It's consumed about as much as the cheap, high salt stuff from the local feed store.

    I have another question, what the best way to prevent udder edema in a first freshener? Like Pre-freshening nutrition wise? Any thoughts?
     
  12. fishin816

    fishin816 Raising Nigerian Dwarf DAIRY Goats, registered wit

    Mar 4, 2011
    Southern Illinois

    Ok then, Sweetlix Meatmaker is the way to go. My girls and boys love MannaPro more than ANYTHING!!! I dont know what is the matter with all these goats. Goats =crazy.
     
  13. LibertyHomesteadFarm

    LibertyHomesteadFarm Member

    613
    Feb 1, 2014
    Mine love MannaPro too...If I gave them a weeks worth, they would probably eat it all in one day. LOL
     
  14. fishin816

    fishin816 Raising Nigerian Dwarf DAIRY Goats, registered wit

    Mar 4, 2011
    Southern Illinois

    My goaties loved MannaPro as well, they chowed and chowed and chowed on it. Now that I found the cow mineral, they love it more and it has better stuff in it for them!
     
  15. GroundGoats

    GroundGoats New Member

    140
    Sep 17, 2013
    They're... Strange.
    When they came here, if it didn't have molasses poured on it, they wouldn't eat it.
    Then they wouldn't eat anything WITH molasses...
    They wouldn't touch mineral blocks, wouldn't touch loose, stole the minerals from the cow blocks, then decided loose was better, but they don't like it anymore... I dunno.
    I thought they would like the MannaPro.

    They like change more than I do.
     
  16. fishin816

    fishin816 Raising Nigerian Dwarf DAIRY Goats, registered wit

    Mar 4, 2011
    Southern Illinois

    Yeah goaties are pretty strange! Then if they don't like molasses, they wont like Sweetlix. Thats why its called SWEETlix! It has all kinds of molasses in it...... Goats stump me sometimes
     
  17. Jessica84

    Jessica84 Well-Known Member

    Oct 27, 2011
    California
    For copper boluses the best price I have found is valley vet. I get the big ones for cattle and their empty capsules and break them down. Its a lot of money at once bit worth it in the end. I'm not a pro but I agree it sounds like copper is the big issue. I had many of your issues when I first started and bought fixer up ers ;) and I saw a big difference in so much when goathiker told me to start doing copper....best advise ever!!!
     
  18. fishin816

    fishin816 Raising Nigerian Dwarf DAIRY Goats, registered wit

    Mar 4, 2011
    Southern Illinois
    I looked at valley vet and i didnt think the prices were great. Ultra cruz was $15 for 25 4g boluses. I bolused my whole herd with it. Jeffers and valley vet was like $20 for ONE 2g bolus! So i thought i got the best deal at ultracruz.
     
  19. GroundGoats

    GroundGoats New Member

    140
    Sep 17, 2013
    Jessica pays $0.12 a gram, Cade pays $0.15 a gram.
    Ultra Cruz's website scares me... Soooooo many chemicals.
    Seems like a huge, diversified conglomerate out to make boucou bucks.
    How long have they been around?
    Composure is a trusted brand, cheaper too.
    I couldn't find Ultra Cruz Boluses that didn't have Selenium as well, but they might be great.
    For the work, Ultra Cruz might be cheaper, but I read you don't have to actually bolus copper, you can add it to their feed over a couple days to get the desired dose.
    Or even bolus half twice as often.
    I guess.
     
  20. fishin816

    fishin816 Raising Nigerian Dwarf DAIRY Goats, registered wit

    Mar 4, 2011
    Southern Illinois
    I think it is too expensive to buy a $50.00 for copper. I think UltraCruz is the best, and my herd does good on it. Many people like Copasure, i like UltraCruz