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sydmurph
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey everyone, I'm thinking about throwing a Togg into my mini project. What I'm wondering, is which color of ND will preserve the togg color and markings, and which will change it? I've seen some mini toggenburgs looking very 'alpiney'. My goal is to preserve the best traits of the breed in the offspring. And for me that means their gorgeous coloring/markings.
 

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That is going to be tricky since you have to look through the whole line and see what they have. Maybe Chamoisee.
 

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Interesting cause the goat vet came out today and saw our mini Toggs and said she thought they looked more like mini alpines d/t the markings.... good to know (the previous owners had no reason to lie, we just wanted dairy minis)....
 

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sydmurph
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199 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
My buck is a really rich solid cocoa color. I'd say chocolate brown. So I wonder how much hidden genetics play with goats (I'm way better acquainted with poultry feather genetics). Wonder if the toggenburg fawn + my 'chocolate' will basically throw something in the fawn-chocolate range and my mini Toggs would retain the Swiss markings; or if something really bizarre would show up like b&w with no alpine markings.
 

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sydmurph
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
So any mini Togg breeders out there? where will I find you, is there a dedicated thread for the breed?
 

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Ideally, you'd be looking for a chocolate swiss or black swiss marked nigerian. They are out there and some look just like miniature toggs. I have a few swiss marked nigerians. If you can't find a swiss, the next best thing would be to cross a togg on a solid nigerian, solid chocolate, black, etc. I wouldn't use a nigerian with white markings, moon spots, or blue eyes and I would stay away from lighter colors like gold.

I'm not a togg or mini togg person, but do know a little about color genetics. :thumb:
 

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sydmurph
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199 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Interesting, KW, sounds like I'm close with the ND. So my choc ND to a togg is the plan.
is the fawn coloration (Toggenburg) a diluted black? And are goat colors sex linked? Am I getting into a big stew of dominant and recessive genetics here; or do goats mix and blend; I.e. brown x white = copper coat. Or are certain colors self limiting; like choc only throws choc or black x black can't throw a white, for example.
so I guess my question is what would the outcomes be?
A) togg with markings and fawn goat, no coat genetics from sire, b) offspring is brown like sire, no togg markings from dam, or c) any assortment of colors within a certain range? Where would I even begin to learn about coat genetics?
 

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sydmurph
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199 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Oh, and my chocolate ND has absolutely no markings other than a smattering of white on ears and muzzle. Nothing alpiney about him!
 

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I'm watching you
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The Alpine markings are the easiest thing to fix...They are a dominant gene. Don't even worry about them. Since chocolate is a modifier and fawn is a modifier they shouldn't work against each other too much. black and black can't produce any color but black. It is recessive except in angora goats. They can however produce black with modifiers that dilute the color to chocolate, red, etc.
Blue eyes are perfectly acceptable in mini-toggs, they are part of the appeal. Also, first generation goats do no have to conform to the color exactly. They give you time to breed them up.

Dr. Phillip Spoonenburg has some good info on the web. There is also a genetics group on Yahoo.
 
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