new to goats - problem

Discussion in 'Goat Frenzy' started by turtlebutte goats, Nov 25, 2008.

  1. turtlebutte goats

    turtlebutte goats New Member

    99
    Nov 22, 2008
    Hello from South Dakota. I am new to goats and came across this blog. I just purchased my first goat, a pygmy billy about 4 months old and weighs 18 pounds. He will be getting playmates next week. He is very alert, eats alot, follows me around, etc. I feed him hay two times a day, and a handful of goat feed 2 times a day. My question is: He looks like he as a small basketball inside him! He is chubby. I have read alot on bloat, but he has none of the symptoms at all. Any ideas? From the goat feed I got for him, the instructions state he is supposed to get about twice the amount I am giving him, but since he is chubby, I'm not.
    Any ideas would be great. Thanks!
     
  2. goatnutty

    goatnutty Active Member

    Oct 9, 2007
    South East,IN
    Our pygmies are the same way. They aren't ill in any way, don't have worms or anything, don't get ed to much...they are just chubby. I would say if he doesn't have worms or anything and isn't showing signs of being ill that he's ok just well...chubby. :wink:
     

  3. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    if he is a true pygmy kid to have a belly is part of their breed character. Other options to consider for why he has a belly would be worms or a hay belly. You can check for a worm overload by checking his eye lids. Are they bright pink or are they pale pink to white? A hay belly is just like it sounds like -- he is full with hay. That is nothing to worry about.

    Is your little guy wethered?

    Welcome to TGS :wave:
     
  4. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    first off welcome to the goat spot.... :wave: so glad you are here.. :) your little buck may have a hay belly in which is normal ....or have a little bloat ....Have free choice baking soda and loose salt and minerals for cattle ...seperate...put these ....out for him.... if he doesn't want to eat it the baking soda ....you can open his mouth and put some in his mouth.....
    He is 4 mo ...what play mates are coming to be with him? Just asking because he shouldn't be put in with young doelings....a wether or another buck would be fine ......because he may try to breed a young doeling........ that wouldn't be to good..... :)
     
  5. MissMM

    MissMM New Member

    645
    Oct 22, 2007
    McGregor, MN
    Hey welcome to the Goat Spot! I'm originally from South Dakota, then got a head injury or something and ended up in Northern Minnesota.

    My pygoras are an angora/pygmy cross and have the "Santa bellly" like you're describing. If he hasn't been wormed recently, I'd do that just in case, otherwise baking soda free choice like the others have said and a good loose mineral. The all purpose livestock mineral like the feed stores like to sell as "just fine for goats" is not good enough. Ask Stacey for some Fasttrack!

    Also keep his water fresh and clean to encourage him to drink plenty.

    Have fun!
     
  6. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    Hi tbg and welcome to tgs (ha, that looks funny! dont mind me I've lost the rational part of my brain somewhere in the last few days).

    Firstly - there is a big difference between how 'fat' goats look in terms of how wide and bulging their belly is, and their actual Body Condition Score (BCS). The BCS is the true indicator of whether or not your goat is overweight. The 'width' and 'bulge' to the belly that you see is just the rumen - and on some goats it does tend to stick out enormously. But that is normal.

    To assess the BCS of your goat, well I started trying to explain it but then I thought a picture might be better.

    [attachment=0:26lnql0a]DSCF4657.JPG[/attachment:26lnql0a]

    Okay, so (I) is where you locate the end of the rib cage of your goat. (II) is the side of the goat where all the intestines, and uterus of a female, are located. Its like a soft hole that you can put your hand into, provided the goat hasnt gorged on hay lol. (III) if you can make out the red line on the top of the goat is the spine. PLACE YOUR THUMB ON THE SPINE. (IV) is what is called the short ribs - you will be able to feel some bones coming off the spine but they are very short. PUT YOUR FOUR FINGERS OF THE SAME HAND ON THE ENDS OF THE SHORT RIBS. NOW 'TICKLE' THE GOAT BY RUNNING YOU HAND BACK AND FORTH ABOUT AN INCH OR TWO. This is how you body condition score and the scores should range from 1 (very thin, emaciated) to 5 (obese). To give you an indication of the way the scores feel: (btw you want to keep them around BCS 3)

    1. Emaciated. The spine and short ribs are sharp to touch, you cant feel any eye muscle in the palm of your hand, cant feel any smoothness (fat cover). You can easily tuck your fingers in under the short ribs.

    2. Thin. The spine is sharp to touch, the short ribs are easily felt but their ends are more rounded. You can feel an eye muscle in the palm of your hand. You can still tuck your fingers in under the short ribs but you need to exert more pressure.

    3. Average/Good. The spine can be felt but it smooth and rounded. The short ribs are more difficult to feel, with significant pressure needed. There is a well defined eye muscle in the palm of your hand and this is covered with a smooth layer of fat.

    4. Fat. The spine can only be felt with pressure as a line - individual vertebrae cannot be felt. The short ribs cannot be felt. The eye muscle has a significant fat layer covering it.

    5. Obese. The spine and short ribs cannot be felt even with significant pressure. Often a depression or dimple is seen along the spine line, caused by the deposition of fat.

    Going back to my picture, there are a couple of other places you can look for deposits of fat, if they are really overweight. (V) is the brisket, between the front legs, this will fill up with fat once the animal is 4 score or above, and begin to resemble a soft 'ball' between the front legs. (VI) is the tail head deposition area, over the top and around the head of the tail (where the tail joins the body) you will get lumps of fat that jiggle when you poke them, if the goat is too fat.
     
  7. kelebek

    kelebek New Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    South Texas
    Welcome from Idaho :wave:

    It would be great if we could see a picture of him (we love our pictures) but it could also help us out. Is his stool regular berries or is a bit runny? It wouldn't hurt to send a fecal to WADDL or to a vet office to have it looked at for worms and cocci.

    Is he intact in the "nether regions"? If so you would only want another intact buckling or a wether as company.

    Sounds like you really like your boy and are keeping a close eye on him - which is great! Can't wait to see those pics!
     
  8. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    Ignoring the obvious fact that this goat has a chicken on its back, if what you are concerned about is the bulging out sides like this goat has, that is normal and not an indication of whether the goat is overweight or not.

    [attachment=0:2t32bki0]01_10_62---Goat-with-Chicken-on-its-back_web.jpg[/attachment:2t32bki0]
     
  9. deenak

    deenak New Member

    296
    Oct 10, 2007
    Ames Iowa
    My pygmy has the basketball thing happening too. This normal for the breed Also Welcome to the Goat Spot!!!
     
  10. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    that is cute keren.... :)
     
  11. turtlebutte goats

    turtlebutte goats New Member

    99
    Nov 22, 2008
    Thank you everyone so much!! All the info is great! Keren, that is exactly what my "little G" looks like, less the chicken! The droppings are normal little berries, no runners. I will get a sample checked though for worms. The playmates coming next week are going to be a whether and another billy. Thanks again for all the info, this will be the tip of the iceberg for me asking questions, so all be prepared!
     
  12. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    I'm trying hard not to offend you here but I've gotta ask ...

    Is there a reason that you are getting two bucks (billies) and no does?
    Are these animals going to be pets?
    Because if so, you really should consider getting the boys desexed. They will make much better pets that way.
     
  13. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    So glad we could help...if you ever have anymore questions...do not hesitate...what so ever...just ask..... :) that is a smart thing to do...getting a stool sample done... :thumbup: ....I bet your buckling will be very happy to see his new playmates... :)

    What is your goal with having goats? will you be wanting kids down the road....or just pets...? :)

    :ROFL:
     
  14. turtlebutte goats

    turtlebutte goats New Member

    99
    Nov 22, 2008
    My intenion was to get the first Billy as a pet for now, learn from him and use him for breeding next year. I am getting the 2nd Billy for companionship, and i also plan on getting quite a few nannys, and will use both Billys separately for breeding next year, to learn from them.
     
  15. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    lol

    Most of us get a wether or a doe to learn with.

    Then we get more does, usually in kid or we take them to the buck to get bred.

    Then after a while we get our own buck.

    :ROFL:

    You are doing it in reverse!!!

    :slapfloor:

    (Dont mind me, lost my mind remember.) Good luck with your new boys and your does when you get them. Keep us updated and remember, we'd love to see pics of your boy! (and the others)
     
  16. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    That sounds wonderful... :thumbup: .....I am so glad you are here and starting to get into the goaties...........just remember..... if you have anymore questions...just ask.... :)


    You know that is very true...but that is perfectly ....OK .....LOL .... :)
     
  17. keren

    keren owned by goats

    Oct 26, 2008
    Australia
    Yup, you are gonna love em! Goats are highly addictive ... my drug of choice :greengrin:
     
  18. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    :ROFL: mine to....LOL
     
  19. liz

    liz Active Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    First off...Welcome! I have pygmies and pygmy Nigerian dwarf crosses...sounds like your little guy is on track for weight...I have a 9 month old doeling that weighs 25 pounds...though the little bucks are fast growers, when you get your wether, you'll notice a difference in size and weight according to age of course. Pygmies are supposed to look like barrels on legs, and short also....my buck's shoulders just barely hit my knees and he's going to be 5 in April. Also...don't ever under estimate the strength of the little guys, they are very strong for their size and I will also suggest secure fencing BEFORE you get any does....those boys are very persistant :ROFL:
     
  20. turtlebutte goats

    turtlebutte goats New Member

    99
    Nov 22, 2008
    Liz- Thanks for all the advice. After reading all the responses, I believe mine is on track. The very first thing I did was to make sure my fencing could withstand anything. I appreciate all the advice!