Out of season breeding?

Discussion in 'Beginners Goat Raising' started by bagelbeagle, Sep 1, 2020.

  1. bagelbeagle

    bagelbeagle Member

    33
    May 4, 2020
    Michigan
    Okay, really weird question here, but are there any other reasons anyone can think of for feeling movement on a doe's belly, besides pregnancy?
    I have an Alpine doe who kidded late this March with twin does. She was purchased by my parents in early June, along with her two doelings. This morning, when milking her, my mom noticed that there was movement on the doe's belly, and when she felt the doe's side, there was a push against her hand. Apparently, it happened multiple times. We started to think it over, and she is a bit bigger than when we got her, she eats a lot more now, and she kind of suddenly dropped in her milk production from over half a gallon a day last week to one quart today. I'd think pregnancy, but Alpines are seasonal, so is there anything else it could be or has she bred out of season? We're newbies here, so this would be our first pregnant doe and we aren't sure what to look for.
     
  2. NigerianDwarfOwner707

    NigerianDwarfOwner707 Well-Known Member

    May 17, 2018
    East Coast, USA
    Could be rumen movements.

    Best to get ultrasound or blood test so you know for sure.
     
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  3. bagelbeagle

    bagelbeagle Member

    33
    May 4, 2020
    Michigan
    Apparently the movement was on the right side, and I thought the rumen was on the left, but I'll definitely have my parents look into that, thanks!
     
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  4. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    You would have to get an ultrasound or blood test to confirm pregnancy.
     
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  5. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
  6. goatblessings

    goatblessings Fair-Haven Supporting Member

    Jan 5, 2015
    Southwest Ohio
    Does she have access to a buck?
     
  7. MellonFriend

    MellonFriend Well-Known Member

    Including a shared fence line?
     
  8. My Dad bought a doe & her two kids, as our first goats. They had been pets & they were very friendly & happy. We noticed they were getting fat & Dad said I was feeding too much. After several months, we were shocked when all three gave birth! We didn’t “know nothing bout birthin’ no babies”!!! That was 3 years ago & I’m wiser. Loo
     
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  9. Goats Rock

    Goats Rock Member

    Jun 20, 2011
    NE Ohio
    Some does didn't get the seasonal breeding memo. I bred an Alpine doe in May, 2 years ago. She kidded in Oct. ( one of those if you aren't bred, you are sold does!) A lot of the 4-H kids want Jan 1 kids, so some people breed at the end of July or early Aug.

    She could be preg. Or, she could have an active rumen and be coming into heat, dropping her production.
     
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  10. lottsagoats1

    lottsagoats1 Well-Known Member

    Apr 12, 2014
    Middle Maine
    I found out when my Alpines and Oberhaslis got pregnant in the early summer that sometimes if the summer is especially rainy and cloudy (making the sky dark with lack of sunshine) this made my girls brain believe it was fall and they all started cycling! I had kids in November and early December!!! It has happened a couple of times since, but I learned the first time and make sure the buck is far away and I watch for heat signs all spring/summer if it's been a rainy season.
     
  11. bagelbeagle

    bagelbeagle Member

    33
    May 4, 2020
    Michigan
    I am so sorry for the late reply! I'm in college right now, so things got a little hectic, and I didn't get any notifications for this thread! To respond to some of the questions, the does and bucks share a fence line because all the goat owners we've met have said fenceline-sharing is okay, although it is something we plan on changing because we've noticed it taints the milk. Also, the doe has had contact with my 5-6 month old bucks when the girls broke into the boys' enclosure in ~July. I don't remember them showing any interest in the girls though; they were mostly upset because the girls were trashing the place! She could have had contact with some bucks, though, before we purchased her as they seemed to be housed close together. Now the movement has gotten harder and larger. Back when I posted this, my mom said it was like a tiny nudge, but now it's a firm pushing occasionally, much larger too. They have not had her tested yet because we don't have livestock vets nearby and my mom, who is usually our needle person, is a little skittish of blood draws, but we're working on it. Her milk production is down to less than a pint.
    I'm posting some pics to show what she looks like from the top now. She's not too big, I don't think, but she's also a big goat. The circle shows where my mom kept feeling and now seeing movement.
     

    Attached Files:

  12. bagelbeagle

    bagelbeagle Member

    33
    May 4, 2020
    Michigan
    Thanks for the reply! I wasn't sure it was even possible with seasonal goats unless there was some massive light manipulation or something, so it's good to know that even something as mundane as weather can cause it.
     
  13. bagelbeagle

    bagelbeagle Member

    33
    May 4, 2020
    Michigan
    Oh, and my parents decided to go for some old homemade testing routes they looked up with trying to put her urine in bleach and on dandelion leaves(???) and got a negative for both of them, so they're back to square one and aren't sure if it's just large rumen movements on the right side or something?
     
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  14. SalteyLove

    SalteyLove Well-Known Member

    Jun 18, 2011
    New England
    If you can post a photo of her backside while she is standing and with tail naturally up, we may be able to hazard a guess as to bred or not based on the shape of her vulva. But no the bleach test is not a reliable answer.
     
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  15. bagelbeagle

    bagelbeagle Member

    33
    May 4, 2020
    Michigan
    It's dark out right now, so the best my parents could get for tonight was this. What should we be looking for?
     

    Attached Files:

  16. SalteyLove

    SalteyLove Well-Known Member

    Jun 18, 2011
    New England
    Ya those photos I can't quite tell, the tail needs to be up naturally, not held. But best guess based on those is not bred. Looking for a relaxing and looseness surrounding the tail head, a poofy and loose vulva, general soft stretched out appearance, and typically the tip of the vulva pointed downwards.
     
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  17. bagelbeagle

    bagelbeagle Member

    33
    May 4, 2020
    Michigan
    Thanks for the tips! It's weird with her because she hits on some of the potential symptoms of pregnancy but some not, so I ordered a pregnancy test to be sent to my parents' house for her. It's a urine test, not a blood test, so less accurate, but I'm going to hold that as the final answer. Thanks so much for the reply!
     
  18. SalteyLove

    SalteyLove Well-Known Member

    Jun 18, 2011
    New England
    Unfortunately the emlabs p-test are extremely unreliable. But you'll know for sure when two hooves and a nose are showing at the back end!
     
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