Question about does and bucks

Discussion in 'Goat Frenzy' started by HoosierShadow, May 4, 2010.

  1. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    My questions are just pouring out the last 24 hours...LOL

    Okay so here's the next question.

    Most everyone I know that has goats breeds them. And they keep their bucks seperate from their does. Is this really necessary? We are hoping to get a buck in the next week if we find one, and I just assumed we could turn him out with our 3 girls? 2 of the girls are pregnant and due in about 2 months. The other one I just got and she is not pregnant.

    BTW, if it matters we are raising boers.

    If it's fine to leave the buck with the does, then I'd rather have him in with them.
     
  2. Galavanting Goat

    Galavanting Goat New Member

    65
    Apr 27, 2010
    Hoosier, some people let their buck run with their does. We don't for a couple of reasons:

    1. we like to see whose being bred and when
    2. Bucks can sometimes have a tendancy to try to mount/breed pregnant does which can in turn be stressfull to the doe when the buck is chasing after her, i've also heard of instances where penetration from the buck has caused miscarriage, not a risk we're willing to take.

    We presently have 6 girls due (4 first week of June and 2 in September), we've needed to move them about 40 meters away from our buck or he goes nuts.

    When you bring your new boy home, I encourage you to put him in an isolation pen for a bit just to make sure he hasn't brought any sickness with him, it will also give you the chance to get to know him before putting him in with your girls if thats what you decide. Some bucks can be totally obnoxious when they're around does, this can make it difficult when you need to catch them if they've sustained an injury.

    If you should decide to keep him seperate from the does, think about getting him a companion like a wether, some bucks hate being alone and yet some prefer it.
     

  3. nancy d

    nancy d Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    near Seattle
    GG pretty much covered it.

    We keep ours seperate for those very reasons. Yep, get a buddy for him & get to know him & be able to handle him. :)
     
  4. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    Thanks so much! I'm going to talk to my husband about this. The only thing I see that could be a problem is keeping him 'away' from the girls. There is an area we can fence off for a buck, but it's next to where the girls are at.
     
  5. Galavanting Goat

    Galavanting Goat New Member

    65
    Apr 27, 2010
    Hoosier, do you have corrugated iron?, i'm not sure what you call it over there, roofing iron maybe? at one stage we had no choice but to keep the buck and his buddy next to the does, but if you place sheets of roofing iron side by side around your boys enclosure at eye level making it two sheets up this stops the boys from seeing the does and restricts their behaviours. They mat cry for a bit but they soon settle down.
     
  6. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    Thanks I will definitely keep this idea in mind!

    Tomorrow I am calling on a buck that is nearby. He's young but able to breed <almost a year old>, and he's very friendly + good with kids <he has a young relative that spends time with him>. The only reason they are selling is because they can't breed him to their does since the buck is closely related to the does.
    He is also full blooded, and can be registered if we want? So we'll see what happens. I'm hoping this works out, as he sounds exactly what we're looking for!
     
  7. Galavanting Goat

    Galavanting Goat New Member

    65
    Apr 27, 2010
    He sounds great, we have a bottle baby buck, he is such a beautiful boy, he's independant but boy oh boy he's a big baby, he doesn't care that he stinks he just wants his hugs and loves. He's about to be a first time dad in a few weeks, he bred our doe when he was 4 1/2 months.

    Let us know how you go.
     
  8. With boers the bucks are normally more agressive so 24 7, though can be done, can run your girls down. I see it as you can doe two things. One is take your girls out after weaning, as you and they need it, so they can recoop and put them back when they have breaked abd bounced back. This leave your boy with other girls to keep him from going too nuts. Now if you are putting him close but not really far. I would line the fince or pen on the inside or out with the big cattle shoot type panels. This way it stays strong and no busting out ot breaking fince. Just my thoughts.
     
  9. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    my bucks share a fenceline with my friends does (I board them at her house) and they are just fine unless one buck is in with the does then they go crazy because they arent the one with the does. Otherwise they are quite fine. She did run a hotwire between the two just to keep the boys off the fence and it really does work.


    I wouldnt run a buck with your does especially when they are close to kidding. This will cause problems as mentioned with him running the does and mounting them. Also after the does kid if they have any doelings themselves the buck will breed them as soon as they come into heat which can be as young as 2 months old. Also a doe who just kidded will go back into heat 5-7 days after kidding. He can breed her right back at that time and this isnt good for the health of the doe.
     
  10. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    Thanks again for all the replies! Unfortuantely I think the buck I mentioned is just too far of a drive for us right now :( So we're continuing our search.
    I am definitely talking to my husband about making a seperate pen for the buck when we get one. I don't want the girls stressed out in any way. I can put the doe who is not pregnant in with him to keep him company and later we can find a whether. He wouldn't need a huge pen, so we'd just have to get a small roll of fencing, and I bet I could find some kind of panels on craigslist or freecycle. That is if he has issues. If he doesn't then I may not worry about panels. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that we don't have any issues when we get one. And we are looking for one that is just old enough for breeding, not a mature adult male. But I do want to find one that is not in with does, so he is at least used to be seperated from them. I wish we could get the buck that our 2 girls were bred to, but then if they have any does when the kid, we wouldn't be able to breed them to him...such a bummer. That guy was good with the girls <they did live in the same pen and he never bothered them>.
     
  11. nancy d

    nancy d Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    near Seattle
    Just a suggestion here, make that pen as strong as possible the first time so you wont necessarily have to go back for re-do.
    We started out with graduated fence for our girls. They broke that stuff down over several months.
    Back then we didnt think about them rubbing or standing on it. :doh:
     
  12. Agreed Nancy. I personally know folks with buck on the does and with out. But most the folks I know with boers have to keep them seperate as they are a bit more agressive. In fact I know one gal that had two bucks in pens site by side and her boer buck broke through the fince with his horns and fought the other buck breaking his horn. She had to rid of him but even the buck they used to replace this buck with was testy enough to need to be put in a pen like I discribes above. The heavy pipe panels with the wire fencing in side to keep from heads getting stuck etc. All buck are different but there are those lines out there that are just very aggressive.
     
  13. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    Thank You so much! I have so much to learn about goats, and sometimes feel overwhelmed, but this website is just awesome and I appreciate all the help! I am used to horses - don't own any, but my husband works with them, and I photograph them <racehorses, sale horses, etc.>, the only time I was ever around a goat I was 7 years old, and really I wasn't around him very much, we didn't have him for very long - he came with horses we bought and we found him a new home.

    I'm still trying to come up with ideas myself on how we should do this. I spoke with my husband about this subject yesterday, the fact we need to keep the buck seperate from our girls so he doesn't try to breed them right away after they have their kids, and to keep the buck away from the kids so they don't get bred too young.

    I was wondering something.... If we built a buck pen. Could we possibly keep young bucklings and whethers with him or do you think, overall a buck might try to hurt them? I am guessing, as soon as they are weaned we'd need to think about seperating the bucklings from the doelings.
    If we can't put them in with the buck, that is fine. We can make a temporary pen for them until we decide what we keep and what we don't keep.

    Also I was wondering...
    If we got a buckling could we keep him in with the girls until his pen is completed, and then seperate them? If he gets lonely we can find him a buddy. I've decided though, that we should use soemthing like field fencing - not sure what it is called but it's much stronger, and they can't get their heads through it, feet on it, etc. because the wires are too close together. My husband will have ways to keep the fence strong so he doesn't go through it. If the buck gets crazy being next to the girls, then we have an acre of wooded area we did start to clean out, and is fenced on one side. We can fence of some of it for the buck and put him back there, he'd be away from the girls. Although I'd want him to be big enough to fend for himself so I wouldn't put anything back there unless I know they are ready - we'd be going back there every day to be with him and work with him, feed him, etc. but I worry about foreign critters.... What age can a buck really start to protect himself?

    Also I refuse to have an aggressive animal that wants to plow through fences, and act crazy. So if we go through bucks like crazy until we find 'Mr. Right.'..... LOL

    Hopefully it works out. I have ideas I want to run by my husband, and one thing we haven't talked about is the wooded acreage that we have. We don't have much, but for what we want to have, it's enough. We have a lot of options. It's just trying to get everything done.

    Thanks again! I have so much to learn, and sometimes it seems overwhelming, but again I thank everyone here for your patience with a 'newbie' like me, and all the information and opinions are very appreciated.
     
  14. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    you wont need to breed your does till fall so what I would do is get a young buckling now -- and that way you can work with him and he respects you.

    NEVER NEVER let him head butt you, or play with you in any way like that. Its cute when they are a couple weeks old but at 200lbs its not.

    I havent been around boers but every buck I have been around hasnt been agressive. Bucks are generally very friendly but because they are strong they get a bad reputation for being nasty and mean due to it being easy for them to push their weight around. Also in rutt they are usually a bit more determined to get their way especially when there are does near by. So being top "goat" is important. You teach them early that pushing and butting, jumping etc are not behaviors you will accept.


    as to the wooded area -- I wouldnt clear much of it, let the goats do that they are great at it. If you can get fencing up in the area that would be an awesome for the goats to go out and eat. THey are browsers by nature. Just watch out for poisonous plants like Mountain Laurel and wild cherry etc that maybe growing. These can kill goats and they dont always know to stay away from them.
     
  15. nancy d

    nancy d Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    near Seattle
    JDGray is right about some lines notorious for aggression.
    Combine that with proper or improper handling & you have a problem child.
    I know of a very experienced breeder getting into trouble with one of hers. It was the lines.
    On the other hand, bucks who have visited here have all been big babies.
    Our boy has been housed with his wethered buddy since weaning. Normally Valentino is pretty good.
    But add a doe or two & try to take them out after a couple of weeks. It takes two of us, one armed with a hot shot.
    Was going to take a friends buckling. Well I know that this guy has had his head handled way to much for my liking.
     
  16. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    Thanks again :) We are going to look at a 5mo paint boer buckling tomorrow afternoon! He looks really cute and I love his markings. I think my husband wants a more traditional looking buck, but I'm not sure it matters unless it would be a flaw for my kids who want to show 4H goats? Guess I need to find out before tomorrow!

    I definitely need to look into information on training a buck. I definitely don't want him head butting, or getting to rough. It'll be a family effort with me, my husband and the kids.

    We are going to finish fencing some of the wooded acreage in in the coming month or two. First we are trying to finish the goat shed. What a job! WHEW LOL!

    I am wondering though, how old should a buck be seperated from the does? If we were to get one around 5 months old should he be seperated soon, or do we have a couple of months to let him stay with the girls? He'd have to be with them when we first bring him home until we get a pen built. If we got the one we are looking at tomorrow, he's stll with a couple of doelings.