Selenium Deficiency?

Discussion in 'Kidding Koral' started by HoosierShadow, Feb 4, 2011.

  1. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    Okay so I had started asking about selenium E Gel in another post in the goat management section. But I wanted to start a topic here in case it can help anyone else too, because I think I 'may' have a kid who is deficient.

    We don't have BoSe, so our month old kids haven't gotten it yet. Hubby started a new job getting paid biweekly so he just got his first full paycheck and we planned to order the selenium e gel since nobody around here sells it.

    Well...doesn't this figure...

    I think my month old buckling has a deficiency. He looks weak in the back end, hunched up, and he's been shivering. He was shivering last night, but once I bedded them down for the night he was fine.
    This morning, he was shivering, so I put a sweater on him before turning him out ---at noon--- and it was up to 38 today...so not bitterly cold.
    He seemed okay after that, no shivering, but he just didn't 'look' right. He didn't act sick either, just....slow, if that makes sense.

    I can't get the selenium e gel until next week. So while I made a quick errand to town I picked up selenium tablets at the dollar store.
    I read on a website you can give them 1 selenium tablet <200mcg>, and 1 vitamin e gel cap.

    This afternoon, when I went out to give it to him, he was shivering, so I wrapped him up in a thick towel, and gave him the selenium/vit e diluted in warm water w/pancake syrup.
    I don't recommend using a syringe...LOL It's hard to get the tablet in them without it squishing to the syringe.... I think I only got half of it in him...but most of the vitamin e gel.
    I recommend putting the vit e gel cap down the back of their throat as I think I've read others have done this somewhere... and I recommend crushing the selenium tablet, mixing it in a tiny bit of warm pancake syrup, and feeding it on a spoon, or if they won't eat it, put it on your finger and stick it down the back of their mouth/throat...

    Okay so I did that.

    He's shivering pretty good despite being bundled up, so I take his temp.
    102.9 which I believe would be borderlining a fever <I can NEVER remeber what is normal for a goat AHHH!!!!!> But seemed high to me.

    Just in case we're not dealing with a deficiency, and with him shivering like he was, I became brave, grabbed the medicine journal I am trying to start....got the correct dosages and gave him:
    banamine
    penG
    I gave the banamine and waited a half hour and gave him the pen G.

    I plugged in the heat lamp and kept it high enough just to help keep the chill off of him, plus so I could see to observe him...
    He seemed to perk up, and stopped shivering! But still looks weak on the backend. Tail down.
    I brought the mineral bucket into the stall, and he was gobbling it up!
    He does NOT eat grain, but he does LOVE alfalfa and as soon as I got him in the stall he was munching.

    He seems fine other than the shivering and seeming weak on the back end. My instincts are screaming selenium deficiency...

    Do you think I am wrong? And if you think I should use a different method of treatment please let me know. I trust the opinions here more than anyone else, because you all know what you are doing and what works.

    BTW, the doeling is showing no signs of problems. She eats almost a handful of grain a day - divided into 2 feedings. However, I wonder if I should at least give her half of a tablet?

    Also, would it be good to give mama a selenium tablet too? I don't want to risk overdosing. She does get a lot of grain, and I do have loose mineral out where they can all get it during the day <But I am going to make it more accessible for the kids while they are in their stall...>

    I should have selenium e gel by this time next week, I am finishing my order TONIGHT.

    Thanks for any advice, and I hope this might help anyone else who doesn't have access to BoSe.
     
  2. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    BTW, when I said I was brave --- I've only given a shot once... a cd/t to my buck last summer.... I've seen banamine and penG injections, know what to do, and SOOOO GLAD I paid attention and am not scared to do it. I think I was more worried about getting the doses correct LOL
     

  3. liz

    liz Well-Known Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    Shelocta PA
    His temp is normal....since he is acting off, that was the best and first thing I would have done...check the temp. What I would have done though before giving any meds was to check his temp again in an hour..if it had gone up then I would have started the PenG..Of course, if the temp rising was because of playing or even the heat lamp, it would have been a tough call.
    I've never used Banamine so I'm not sure of that one.
    Since you initialized the antibiotic, be sure to continue the course, even if he's better.
    Give him a dab of probiotic paste too...at 4 weeks old, the rumen is just starting to work so you may be able to feel some grumbling if you check, seeing as he loves alfalfa hay, he could have a belly ache, watch him for diarhea and be sure to have a pail of water where he can access it, even if you've not seen him drink from a bucket, having it available to him might entice him to stay hydrated.
    As far as a selenium deficiency, I've no experience with that either, only what I have read. I do know that you likely won't see results with giving selenium orally as fast as what you would if given by injection, but oral is better than not treating at all. If you have a good fortified mineral with Selenium and Vit E as well as a fortified grain, you shouldn't have to treat mom. I'm in a deficient area and haven't had any deficiency sign with my goats and they get a good mineral and grain.
     
  4. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    Thanks so much for the fast reply Liz!
    When I took his temp he was outside, I didn't put the heat lamp on until about an hour after I gave him the banamine.
    His temp is around 101.8 now, I went out to check on him, and they were resting. Mama is always good about letting them nurse, she will let them nurse a few times an hour, but of course they are short feedings.
    They get the alfalfa only in the stall, so around 6-6:30pm we put them in the stall with alfalfa, and they have grass hay as well.
    I will get probiotic paste, I'll see if the local feed store has it. I was at TSC last weekend and it was on my list of things to get, but they were sold out of just about everything except for like 2 things on my list.
    He nursed, went back to the alfalfa, and ran back and forth to the mineral bucket a few times.
    I believe where I had it at for all goats to get to they may have had a little trouble reaching the mineral when it was eaten down, so I'll make sure I keep some in their stall and lower the bucket for when they are outside.

    He still acts weak on the back end, but hopefully it's just a selenium deficiency and it'll clear up in a few days. We need BoSe, but will get the selenium e gel to give at birth. Eventually we will get BoSe, I'm working on it, but want to make sure I have the gel on hand...

    Not being sure what was going on with him - that's why I started the penG, just in case it was something else, and I was wrong about the deficiency.

    BTW, we use Ultralyx goat mineral 16:8
    Selenium : 50ppm
    Vit E : 400IU/lb

    Hopefully this will get him fixed up. He is healthy otherwise, and growing really well, he's almost 25lbs <7-8lbs at birth>, he's filling out and is getting wider at the shoulder and hips. He's such a little sweetie.

    Edited to add: We do give a good grain, I can't remember the amounts in it, but everyone in the area recommended it. So I wasn't overly worried about mama, but wanted to ask. She gets a lot of grain each day, and knows where the mineral is at. We've not had any problems with any of the others on this matter. I am more concerned with making sure they have the selenium at birth.
     
  5. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    I thought I'd note that he seemed much better this morning, didn't look as weak and he ACTUALLY ATE GRAIN! He's been sticking his nose up at it, but this morning he was really interested.
    It's been a dreary, wet morning so hopefully it'll improve and I can get him outside to observe this afternoon.