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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
As mentioned and possibly over due
(Can I seriously pick your brains any more?)


I have hard well water.
Neighbor had theirs tested, same spring source.
High calcium, high iron, elevated molybdenum.

My goats suffer terribly for this and what I have done to remedy it is not showing improvement. Help me think outside the box here.

I can't think of any symptom we do not have from low copper, low zinc, low selenium.
I have researched endlessly about mineral interactions and goat needs and symptoms.

There are 2 area vets doing goats. One prefers to rake cash flow in doing emergency calls, but I hear the other is really good with regular needs. Currently, there are limited services even for emergency calls. Our state is in lockdown. It's not an option to "just call a vet". I honestly don't believe a vet can tell me anything I do not know at this point.


Our herd is broken into several "dry lots".
Our clay soil can barely grow dandelions. After a year's worth of goats trodding and pooping on pasture 1, I may be able to get some forage seeded out. Seed is waiting and ready to try.

After much trial and error, we currently offer:

Daily ration of timothy pellets
Daily ration of kelp
Weekly Replamin gel (started last month to replace SeleniumE) 5cc
Weekly herbal wormer
Manna Pro mineral available, this is a high calcium but junk on copper mix. Often is ignored but I feel like it is insurance if they eat too much copper magically
Daily refresh of Sweetlix Magnum Milk mineral, which is designed for a very high calcium diet so has high copper, zinc, etc. Disappears as fast as I put it out, far over the recommended servings.

Only does in late pregnancy and in milk get grain here. They also get some alfalfa pellets.
Time constraints found me buying a bag of nasty molasses junk. I'd really rather go back to mixing soaked grains, but I don't dare try with the shut downs on everything. I might run out and be forced to buy sweet feed anyway, so that's what they got at this time.

Our hay is currently early first cut grass hay. They like it ok. Lots of variety in it and only the thickest of stems are being discarded. It was not possible to obtain second cut last year without paying $12/bale off the field.


I've briefly looked at water softeners and concluded the use of sodium to replace calcium is also not smart.
Do not know of an alternative.
We plan to create a very large rainwater collection system, but we are looking at a year or 2 out. It will cost a lot and may require our contractor family to help. We have half the supplies ready.

In one year, I have copper bolused 2g capsules every 3 months. Since I'm still seeing the symptoms get worse, I feel comfortable increasing that bolus dose to 4g. I did go ahead and do so for the problem child goat.



And now...
Tell me what you know that I did not list here?
 

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Do you have access to alfalfa hay? If not have you tried aflalfa pellet or a tim falfa mix pellet? We have hard well water here too and i need dose copper every threeish months as well. Ours get either a good tim orchard grass hay or a pasture mix with lots of different stuffs in it. The mineral they eat like crazy... can you put up the analysis on it? Can you post pics of your goats? I know you had some kidding issues... maybe the replamin ised regularly for preg and lactating does will help a lot. Do you ever do BOse? What about a top dress for more zinc? Tru care top dress worked well for my buck that was needing it.
 

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Where are you located? If you’re near ID, OR, or WA, I have an excellent loose mineral to recommend.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Alfalfa hay is a high calcium food, so would act as another antagonist.
That's if I could get it good priced. I haven't looked too hard based on calcium content alone.


Hoping for sure that Replamin will help. That was only added late February, so need more time. Neighbor uses it and has good results.

We chewed through a full bag of TruCare zinc in under 2 weeks. They definitely approved and it definitely helped to fix the flaky skins and weird thick flakes on udders.
This was given same time as beginning the Replamin. Hoping to not need to add another bag to our regular schedule, and that Replamin will now cover it.

Last I read, BoSe is vet prescription only and most vets refuse to use it around here. Something I cannot even get an answer on during lockdown.


Attached pic here is that crusty skin on udders we were having, that is now almost entirely resolved (yay! 1 point for me!)

I will add some other pics as I can here...
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Here is link to the Sweetlix mineral we have used since mid January.

https://www.sweetlix.com/products/60732-magnum-milk-mineral/

Trying to find pics of Earth. She has very dramatic color changes and suffered hair loss and crusties around eyes. After kidding, her hair has slowly been growing back and improved greatly after the TruCare and Replamin additions. However, her color has significantly washed out.
Note: she had a total of 4g copper bolus this month to try and help her out.
Not sure what order they appear in here. One to show her chocolate color, one to show scabby eyelids, one to show wash out (taken 2 days ago)
 

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Here is link to the Sweetlix mineral we have used since mid January.

https://www.sweetlix.com/products/60732-magnum-milk-mineral/

Trying to find pics of Earth. She has very dramatic color changes and suffered hair loss and crusties around eyes. After kidding, her hair has slowly been growing back and improved greatly after the TruCare and Replamin additions. However, her color has significantly washed out.
Note: she had a total of 4g copper bolus this month to try and help her out.
Not sure what order they appear in here. One to show her chocolate color, one to show scabby eyelids, one to show wash out (taken 2 days ago)
That coat does not look bad at all. The udder kinda looks like staph skin to me.

Yes BoSe is rx only but it is good when needed. We do before breeding here for everyone and if someone looks like they need it again later we do it. But you have to be careful with it.... maybe that is why the vet does not want to sell you a bottle. And i would ask for a bottle instead of doses cause a bottle is not horrible expensive. When i ask for a bottle of rx stuff the convo usually goes like this..... i ask for what it is i need, the vet asks me what is it used for, dosage and how often, when not to use it and why do you want it nicki. I have already done my research on whatever i am askin for so i give my correct answers. Vet says ok you know what you talkin bout here it is. But my vet is kinda wonderful too. He also knows that if i do have a problem i will call him out to the farm. A good relationship helps. So maybe if you took the this is why i need it approach with your vet he would be more willing? Also ask for a bottle of banamine if you do not already have one.
 

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I think you are likely going to turn a corner with another month of Replamin dosing in all probability.

For me, MultiMin90 injections are the answer. I know, I know, it's Rx so doesn't really solve your issue. But that is what made all the difference in my herd. I don't know of a "black market" source for this but if you have utilized a vet before, I would take a stab in the dark and just send them the online script request through the website. The worst that will happen is the vet will reject it and your order will be cancelled.

I do think roof rainwater collection helps too. I don't have a whole storage system set up, but I do have a roof gutter on one side of the barn and collect and use the water when feasible.
 
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