Sick Doe

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by kornhypknotic, Jun 15, 2009.

  1. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Ok, I will try to be concise but thorough.

    Allie (4 years old Saanen doe) freshened three weeks ago when she kidded triplets. Three males, one was DOA and appeared to have been dead for quite a while inside her. Assistance was necessary during his delivery. Both his brothers are healthy. Since she needed help I gave her 3cc pen-aqueous daily for 3 days to ward off any infection.

    For about 1 or 2 weeks after freshening she was doing very well in milk production and health. About 2.5-3 weeks she began losing weight and her Somatic Cell Count came back very high (3 million). I treated with ToDAY (2 doses in 24 hours) and when retested her SCC remained the same. I then treated with MastiClear (2 doses in 24 hours) and her SCC was greatly reduced (just under 1 million).

    Throughout this time she continued to lose weight and at one point displayed a mild fever (104F). I gave her 3cc pen-aqueous for 3 days and she perked up and began eating better. There was slight weight gain. When I tested her for h. contortus worms (FAMACHA score of anemia) she scored a 4, pretty anemic (1= no worms and 5= dying any second due to anemia). I treated her with Rumatel to no avail. I retreated her the next day and still no results. Finally I used Safeguard, Probiotics, and included injections of B12 and A & D vitamins. Her health did not improve, nor did it get much better, although her score of anemia returned to a 3 - not too horribly anemic.

    Today (1 week after the Safeguard, etc.) I checked her and she had a fever of 105F, she has lost even more weight, her anemia score was back to a 4 (pretty bad) and now refuses grain altogether (she still browses a bit off and on during the day though). I gave her 3cc pen-aqueous again, dosed her with ivomec sheep and goat oral drench, more b12, more probiotics, and an infusion of Masticlear in the left half (today it was swollen, hot, and had very low milk letdown).

    I'm so confused! What is going on with her!!! :hair:

    PS: anyone know what the milk withdrawal is for ivomec?
     
  2. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    One thing is you are not using enough antibiotics for long enough. If anything the low dose for a short amount of time is creating resistant bacteria. Try the pen g at 1cc per 10lbs twice a day for 7 days. You need to kill these resitant bacteria. Better yet use another antibiotic if you have it.

    Safeguard has become pretty weak. I would give her the safeguard for 3-5 days. That will kill the worms and their eggs. Make sure you give the ivomec again in 7-10 days. Ivomec milk withdrawal isn't that long. Some people wait 3 days, others 20.
     

  3. sealawyer

    sealawyer New Member

    366
    May 31, 2009
    Dew, Texas
    She is a milk breed? If you treat her with cydectin will it hurt the kids? If you do you can't use the milk for human consumtion. Treat her with Cydectin injectable at a dosage of 1 cc per 50 pounds of goat orally. You can inject the goat at 1 cc per 100 pounds and it will do just as well. Since she is sick, you wouldn't be using the milk for people food anyway? This may be the only thing that is effective. Watch her for sudden worm release in her stomach and give her some good old Geritol that you get from the store. It's good for them and it tastes good too. Gwen lets the goats sniff the drencher first and they start lappin' at the drops coming out and take it readily. Just a trick learned from an old goat man. With the Cydectin, if you give just a little too much it won't hurt them.
    Get her well soon before it gets worse. Good Luck!
     
  4. sealawyer

    sealawyer New Member

    366
    May 31, 2009
    Dew, Texas
    Sorry folks, but ivomec doesn't even work in Texas anymore. Folks are finding that Cydectin and prohibit work best. The rest are just like treating them with water.
     
  5. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Ashely is correct - you need to give Penicillin for at least 5 days for full effect or you start to do more harm then good, 7 days is even better. I use 1cc per 20lbs for mild cases of infection but 1cc per 10lbs for major cases.

    I would try LA 200 or something stronger like Naxcel though now as Ashely also stated.

    a vet could give you a more accurate diagnosis as she is showing symptoms of several things and her anemia could be directly related to her infection as the body is trying its hardest to heal itself.

    Sounds like you need to find a stronger wormer - Fred seems to know what is best for your area so I would go with his recomendation.
     
  6. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    This morning she had a fever of 105.1F so I gave her 5 baby aspirin with her penicillin and second teat infusion of dry-cow Masticlear because they don't sell the masticlear for lactating cattle in my area (I plan to infuse her 4 times total).

    Good Grief! :angry: I was following the directions on the pen-aqueous bottle (even giving more than the bottle said) and the instructions in the Texas A&M textbook "Livestock Health Management" where it says to give penicillin for 3 days after assisting in a delivery. I was doing all of this so I wasn't creating antibiotic resistant bacteria! :hair: This is so confusing! Everything says something different!

    But the bottle says 1cc per 100lbs! I am hoping to use her milk for human consumption . . . wont the withdrawal period be really long if I treat 1cc per 10lbs?

    But you can't use their milk for people if you treat with Cydectin, right? That's what the farm is planning to use her for. She was one of our best producers last year. :sigh:

    It's 99F out here and that certainly does not help her fever. She has constant access to shade and fresh water, but she's not really interested in eating as much as usual. Could her temperature be so high because of the heat outside?
     
  7. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    if she is dead or sick for long she isnt worth a thing to the farm. Best to treat her, then wait to use the milk.

    As to the penicillin - Idont know why the bottles never lable it for goats but according to my vet and all conventional wisdom 1cc per 20lbs or 1cc per10lbs is very normal for goats and you do give it for 5-7 days no less.

    YOu need to get the TODAY - it is a mastitis treatmet for lactating dairy. You can get it from several locations. I know http://www.jefferslivestock.com carries it as does valleyvet.com and http://www.hoeggars.com

    you are already treating her with all these things - the milk withdrawl time I wouldnt knwo but with the mastitis you cant drink the milk anyway till it is cleared up
     
  8. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    I tried that first and it didn't do a thing (somatic cell counts stayed in the 3millions). When I used Masticlear and penicillin shots it cleared up for a short while . . . that's why I'm using the masticlear now.

    I'm planning on holding her milk for 1 week after I stop all treatment. Does that sound pretty safe?

    Thanks so much for all your help and wisdom, everyone :grouphug:
     
  9. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    if the milk is being used for human consumption and for sale then I would assume there are regulations that you need to check into. A vet would know more about it.

    As to the Today I am surprised it didnt work, but glad you have something that does work
     
  10. sweetgoats

    sweetgoats Moderator

    Oct 18, 2007
    Peyton CO.
    I think they all said it already. I was going to say the same thing. You have to treat her and get that cleared up before she is dead, or you will not have any chance of using any milk. Check the bottle for the Withdraw period.

    I would also keep giving her the Vit B12 at a rate of 1cc per 50#. That will help with her anemia and stimulate her appetite. Also I would give her some Calcium, if you have CMPK, if not get some calcium pills cruch them and let her eat the powder and as much as she would like.
     
  11. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    The second vet I called said to use 2.5cc penicillin per day for 5-7 days and include the B12 as well.

    How often should I give her that? I've been giving her about 3cc daily (she weighs 145lbs). I figure more couldn't hurt?? :shrug:

    ToDay hasn't worked well for me. I think the farm may have used it a lot in the past so maybe our girls are becoming immune? :shrug:

    Thanks again everyone! :hug: The health issues have been kicking my butt lately :GAAH: . . . I need a break :coffee2:
     
  12. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    You are going to want to give the pen G at least 7 days now that you have created resistant bacteria. Did the vet you talked to have any experience with goats?
     
  13. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Yeah, some . . . he grew up on a meat goat farm. :shrug:
     
  14. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Today her fever is 106F!!!! :shocked: I'm switching to the LA200 and I gave her 7cc this morning according to the cattle dosage on the box. I assume that's probably wrong though . . . what dose would y'all recommend for the LA200?

    When I gave her the B12 she started eating pretty well so she's not off feed . . . but she's incredibly skinny :tears:

    Edit: I also dumped cool water all over her to bring her temp down. She looked a little perkier afterward and thank God there's a breeze today! :worried:
     
  15. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    I give the LA 200 at 1cc per 20lbs

    so yah unless she is only 140 lbs you need to give her more
     
  16. sweetgoats

    sweetgoats Moderator

    Oct 18, 2007
    Peyton CO.
    She needs to go to a vet that knows goats NOW days, not just one that raised them a long time ago.

    I would not wait, she also needs some Banamein (sp) for her temp to get it down.
     
  17. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    I totally agree with Lori here, the poor doe needs a vet quickly, one that knows goats. I am very concerned. :(
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2014
  18. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    I have some of that medicine to get her fever down. I can give her that now.

    I don't think there are vets around us that have good knowledge in goats. :shrug: I've done some looking . . .

    If her fever does not improve by tomorrow on the LA200 I will take her to the vet. :tears:
     
  19. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    She weights 145
     
  20. ksacres

    ksacres New Member

    161
    Oct 30, 2007
    San Antonio Texas
    You say she is very skinny. It is normal for dairy goats to have a "thin" look, especially when compared to meat/pet breeds.

    If she is truly very thin, then has she been tested for John's, CAE, and CL? All three of these diseases can cause "chronic wasting", which is basically an animal becomming thin over time while having access to, and eating, adequate amounts of food. CAE has been tied chronic mastitis/edema issues as well. CL can cause abscesses inside the udder. I don't know that much about John's, other than it can cause impaired immune function-thereby leaving the goat susceptable to frequent infections.