The problem is that you will have to figure out what works for your farm. If you have no pasture, they will need hay. Whether you figure out how much they eat in a day and only put that much out or have the hay full all the time is up to you. As far as minerals, you buy the best one you can find. You can always supplement. Alfalfa pellets are always something you can feed. Then depending on what your herd is for will depend on what feed or not you want to give. Again you will just have to find the best local feed. Keep in mind something like Purina Miniature Horse and Pony can also work along with a goat specific feed.
So confusing
There are two things I find absolutely confusing about keeping goats. One is "color" (meaning the official designation for registration). The other is feed. There are so many variables to the feed question that. Many answers come from a basis of having browse or pasture. Other answers are from people who don't have any pasture and everything the goat gets has to be fed. Often, it's not clear which set of feeding suggestions come from which basis. Then, geography makes a difference because what's in the water, what's in the hay, and what's available at the feed store all makes a difference. In my area, so far, all I've been able to find for loose minerals are Manna Pro and (occasionally) Purina. In reading the forums, there were several other brands that are suggested, but that I can't find. And even in a local, I've talked to 5 different local goat herders and have gotten 5 different ways to feed. So after reading many discussions, and because most of the discussions are old enough that if I made a comment on there it'd be like resurrecting an old thread, please let me ask:
1) If you don't have access to pasture, would you get the hay you buy tested for calcium and phosphorus? Is there even any point to testing hay you get from a feed store like TCS, Shoppers, or The Feed Barn since I'd expect they have many sources for the hay they sell?
and
2) Do you limit anything or free feed everything? Mostly thinking pellets (if given at all) and loose hay (should always be given, but I've come across some who give as free feed and others who only put out X number of flakes per day)
1) If you don't have access to pasture, would you get the hay you buy tested for calcium and phosphorus? Is there even any point to testing hay you get from a feed store like TCS, Shoppers, or The Feed Barn since I'd expect they have many sources for the hay they sell?
and
2) Do you limit anything or free feed everything? Mostly thinking pellets (if given at all) and loose hay (should always be given, but I've come across some who give as free feed and others who only put out X number of flakes per day)
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
I agree with what has been said by ksalvagno.
What you said about getting 5 different ways to feed, everybody feeds their goats differently. By reading on here and watching Blue Cactus Dairy Goats and Weed em’ and Reap, I realized everybody feeds their goats differently. Just do what works for you and your goats.
I’m in the process of changing my goats’ feed up a little right now because I’m feeding them a lot of what they shouldn’t be getting a lot of.
What you said about getting 5 different ways to feed, everybody feeds their goats differently. By reading on here and watching Blue Cactus Dairy Goats and Weed em’ and Reap, I realized everybody feeds their goats differently. Just do what works for you and your goats.
I’m in the process of changing my goats’ feed up a little right now because I’m feeding them a lot of what they shouldn’t be getting a lot of.
This is soooo true in many subjects. Everyone has their way and for the most part works.I've talked to 5 different local goat herders and have gotten 5 different ways to feed
We keep things super simple here, coastal hay 24/7. Chaffaye and Whole oats and BOSS 2 times a day. Loose minerals are Sweet lix meat maker. That's it. Our oats and BOSS Is mixed 6 to 1 ratio. We do have to copper bolus and do BoSe.
We raise dairy goats. Meat goats may need higher protien for muscle building. We do not have pasture for our goats..although their area does grow grasses they don't normal graze it enough and wouldn't sustain them any way.
Best way to know if your goats are doing well I n how you feed is judge their over all condition.
Coats should be smooth and glossy
Eyes bright and alert
Look up body condition scores and see if you're are too thin or too fat.
Pooping berries
Parasite resistance. Including lice mites and internal parasites. Healthy goats resist better.
Hoof growth (too much protien can cause rapid growth)
Settling and Kidding with ease
Getting Twin and triplets (too many singles can point toward mineral deficiency)
Babies born strong and healthy
Spend time assessing your herd. Make notes. Keep records of who maybe a weak link and need more supplemental care.is the over all herd looking good? Then post pictures here or ask a friend to come assess. We see them every day and can miss things. (Farm blindness) Ask us or your friend to be brutally honest and don't take offense. Take notes and when alone..once a gain assess your herd with your notes. See your herd through a different lense and decide what if any changes are needed.
It takes time to build up what works for you, your budget, herd and area.
Best wishes
i went through this, you will figure out what works best for you. Till now i still make small changes from time to time in feeding schedule/quantites/type.
Can you believe there's two different goat owners near me, the first one free ranges his goats all day without feed( i don't like this but it works for him!) and the second one offer them hay 24/7 with feed
Can you believe there's two different goat owners near me, the first one free ranges his goats all day without feed( i don't like this but it works for him!) and the second one offer them hay 24/7 with feed
I hear your frustration :/ feed is the most challenging thing there is and sadly as you well know it’s not so cut and dry as one thinks it should be. I admit after 12 years for the most part I am fairly pleased with how I feed but I still will try tweaking it a little or add something.
First your questions!
1. No honestly I don’t think it would be worth it. As you said they have many sources and also bale to bale will differ some. My parents grow hay and we test it. Not saying they are pros by any means but their large field there is quite a difference from the first check to the last.
2. Ehhhh kinda both. If feeding small bales I will give what they will consume till next feeding. So what I mean by that is I’ll give say 4 flakes, if there is hay left when I feed again they get 3 flakes, or if 4 and they are out well before feeding again I’ll give 5 flakes. Pellets, as in grain I don’t feed my adults grain unless they need weight. Growing nursing kids get free choice in a creep feeder. Alfalfa pellets I once gave free choice but ended up with a doe that liked the pellets more then they hay and got acidosis. Some do have luck free choice, I did not so if I ever tried again wouldn’t do free choice.
First your questions!
1. No honestly I don’t think it would be worth it. As you said they have many sources and also bale to bale will differ some. My parents grow hay and we test it. Not saying they are pros by any means but their large field there is quite a difference from the first check to the last.
2. Ehhhh kinda both. If feeding small bales I will give what they will consume till next feeding. So what I mean by that is I’ll give say 4 flakes, if there is hay left when I feed again they get 3 flakes, or if 4 and they are out well before feeding again I’ll give 5 flakes. Pellets, as in grain I don’t feed my adults grain unless they need weight. Growing nursing kids get free choice in a creep feeder. Alfalfa pellets I once gave free choice but ended up with a doe that liked the pellets more then they hay and got acidosis. Some do have luck free choice, I did not so if I ever tried again wouldn’t do free choice.
This is not meant as any form of negative but it does express some frustration on my part... It certainly isn't directed at the person quoted but the message presented the best opportunity to.... vent.
For the first couple of years, I thought I might have a "rex goat" before I realized it was probably a copper deficiency and started bolusing. Didn't even know it was an issue. And how would I tell a selenium deficiency before a disastrous birthing or a calcium/phosphorus imbalance before urinary calculi. I'd really like to prevent instead of treat such conditions. I'm sure over time I'll get to know these things by sight. I did with rabbits (well, not these conditions but conditions that are unique to rabbits). But it took time, and it took poor outcomes, and it sometimes scares me to death when I walk out and see a goat laying down by the hay rack instead of up somewhere trying to cause trouble... only to have the goat bound up as soon as I walk past the beet root (which all my goats seem to love) hoping for a treat.... but I still wonder if she's getting what she needs...
Ok, this was a bit of a frustration rant that's only possible because I've elevated my goats from "2 yard pets" to an active herd where "more things can go wrong." Please don't be offended, anybody. I'm really trying to express one new persons point of view.
For someone like me, this is easier said then done. In a lot of ways, "condition" is vague and that is where I have problems. I am a pretty analytical person. Tell me that the widget should be 36cm. Or the distance from the doohickey to the wingding should be twice the distance from the wingding to the who-zit and I can pull out a tape measure and tell you if all is well. I like that I know a goats vitals because I know how to take temperatures, count heartbeats, and listen to breath sounds. I'm going to have a field day this spring with a microscope and goat poop. But when I look at the sheet for doing linear appraisals, I get discouraged. What is a fat goat vs normal rumen vs bloat vs pregnant. Some of it seems to be "a little bigger" or "a little firmer" or...post: 2586737 said:Spend time assessing your herd.
Best way to know if your goats are doing well I n how you feed is judge their over all condition.
Look up body condition scores and see if you're are too thin or too fat.
For the first couple of years, I thought I might have a "rex goat" before I realized it was probably a copper deficiency and started bolusing. Didn't even know it was an issue. And how would I tell a selenium deficiency before a disastrous birthing or a calcium/phosphorus imbalance before urinary calculi. I'd really like to prevent instead of treat such conditions. I'm sure over time I'll get to know these things by sight. I did with rabbits (well, not these conditions but conditions that are unique to rabbits). But it took time, and it took poor outcomes, and it sometimes scares me to death when I walk out and see a goat laying down by the hay rack instead of up somewhere trying to cause trouble... only to have the goat bound up as soon as I walk past the beet root (which all my goats seem to love) hoping for a treat.... but I still wonder if she's getting what she needs...
Ok, this was a bit of a frustration rant that's only possible because I've elevated my goats from "2 yard pets" to an active herd where "more things can go wrong." Please don't be offended, anybody. I'm really trying to express one new persons point of view.
Okay well I think I can help you out with this at least. 🙂 When determining a goat is fat you are looking not at the belly, but at the muscling and fat deposits over the transverse process.What is a fat goat vs normal rumen vs bloat vs pregnant.
Bloat vs healthy rumen is easy too, but you can't do it just by looking at them. A healthy rumen will feel squishy or if really full sort of like playdough. A bloated rumen will be "drum tight" and feel like a balloon ready to pop. You'd know it if you felt it.
Pregnant or not is a whole other matter. And going on belly size alone actually can be extremely deceiving. For that you'd want to be looking at the vulva's puffiness and udder development. That being said pregnant does bellies will become more prominent on the right side because they kids are on that side. A big rumen will be on the left and big with kids will be on the right side of their body. "Left lunch, Right Rugrats".😉
I liked your frustration rant!😉 Ive had a few of those myself. Goats are not linear. They are a miss guided missle pinging off of any bend of light. Lol
I have meat goats. They require a little extra protien. I give Purina goat grower to my young ones. I add a show feed + Purina goat grower to my breeding adults. Because of extra nutritiin requirements for birth. I feed them a minimul amount if 1 cup per head in morning & evening. In the fall & winter, they have free choice hay. In Spring, summer they have pasture and get 1 feeding of grain each day.
Thats what keeps my goats healthy, active and easily reproductive.
I do give free choice minerals and water. I copper bolus every 3 months, and only worm when their pellets change or if their hair changes. Ill do a fecal and decide what needs to be done.
Their is no set answer. Sorry. Its only by trial and error and trying what other experienced people have suggested.
I have meat goats. They require a little extra protien. I give Purina goat grower to my young ones. I add a show feed + Purina goat grower to my breeding adults. Because of extra nutritiin requirements for birth. I feed them a minimul amount if 1 cup per head in morning & evening. In the fall & winter, they have free choice hay. In Spring, summer they have pasture and get 1 feeding of grain each day.
Thats what keeps my goats healthy, active and easily reproductive.
I do give free choice minerals and water. I copper bolus every 3 months, and only worm when their pellets change or if their hair changes. Ill do a fecal and decide what needs to be done.
Their is no set answer. Sorry. Its only by trial and error and trying what other experienced people have suggested.
No offense taken. I hear ya loud and clear. It's easy for us who been doing for a long time forget that some members haven't and I apologize for not keeping that in mind when I posted and added to your frustration.Please don't be offended, anybody.
It does take time to learn what to look for. And we certainly hope to do that before something goes south. Mellonfriends post should help get started in the fat or thin department.
Best wishes
When you feed the grains and feed, do you separate them or do you just count the heads and put that many cups in the feeder? "Frustration rant" aside, it didn't take me long to learn that goat husbandry is largely trial and error. I'm still going to try to quantify it as much as I can. That's just how I'm wired.I liked your frustration rant!😉 Ive had a few of those myself. Goats are not linear. They are a miss guided missle pinging off of any bend of light. Lol
I have meat goats. They require a little extra protien. I give Purina goat grower to my young ones. I add a show feed + Purina goat grower to my breeding adults. Because of extra nutritiin requirements for birth. I feed them a minimul amount if 1 cup per head in morning & evening. In the fall & winter, they have free choice hay. In Spring, summer they have pasture and get 1 feeding of grain each day.
Thats what keeps my goats healthy, active and easily reproductive.
I do give free choice minerals and water. I copper bolus every 3 months, and only worm when their pellets change or if their hair changes. Ill do a fecal and decide what needs to be done.
Their is no set answer. Sorry. Its only by trial and error and trying what other experienced people have suggested.
Here's where the real frustration comes from. I've been feeding alfalfa hay free feed for my girls but I'm thinking of switching to grass (probably teft), but I've read that I have to be careful. I can throw off the calcium/phosphorus balance. So that's kinda where this started. I'm trying to figure out how to make sure I have the 1:1-1:2 ratio that goats need. I'm just unsure how to do that giving my situation (no pasture, feed store hay). So... I'll just have to give it a go and... watch for signs that they're unhappy.
@FarmerDad ..I count the goats in that area, mix the feed into a plastc coffee container. I pour the mix into their individual feeders.
I just feed local hay, mixed grasses. The only alfalfa I feed is in pellet form, since I have 4 Breeding Bucks. The rest are does & kids.
Sounds like you have a good plan, and are learning, just like the rest of us. 👍
I just feed local hay, mixed grasses. The only alfalfa I feed is in pellet form, since I have 4 Breeding Bucks. The rest are does & kids.
Sounds like you have a good plan, and are learning, just like the rest of us. 👍
Are the goats physically separated/restrained or do they do a round robin of eating a few bites before moving to the feeder next to them? That's the other part of what I'm trying to work out. When I have pregnant does or does in milk and want to give them grain... In the past, I just put their ration in the feeder of the milk stand and let them eat from there, one-by-one. Worked when I had, at most, two does needing grain but I'm hoping to have 12 by the end of the year and feeding grains that way seems a little time consuming.I count the goats in that area, mix the feed into a plastc coffee container. I pour the mix into their individual feeders.
I just feed local hay, mixed grasses. The only alfalfa I feed is in pellet form, since I have 4 Breeding Bucks. The rest are does & kids.
Sounds like you have a good plan, and are learning, just like the rest of us. 👍
How about have short ropes or dog leashes and at feeding time, tie each goat you want to have x amount of grain to the fence around the pen they eat in and give them each their own bowl. It might not be as time consuming as having to feed each goat one at a time.Are the goats physically separated/restrained or do they do a round robin of eating a few bites before moving to the feeder next to them? That's the other part of what I'm trying to work out. When I have pregnant does or does in milk and want to give them grain... In the past, I just put their ration in the feeder of the milk stand and let them eat from there, one-by-one. Worked when I had, at most, two does needing grain but I'm hoping to have 12 by the end of the year and feeding grains that way seems a little time consuming.
I start when my goats are small. Right now I have my adult does in groups of six. I have six feeders and each doe goes to her bowl. I stand there why they eat. They dont move to another bowl, until I walk away. They seem to eat better, and no one is bullied. But again I start when they are about 2 months old.
If I purchase an older doe. I do use a halter with a snap to attach them to a feeder. Then they learn their space, and their feeder. It takes about a week.
If I purchase an older doe. I do use a halter with a snap to attach them to a feeder. Then they learn their space, and their feeder. It takes about a week.
In truth, unless you are raising wethers the cal-phos ratio does not have to be exact. What's important is that lactating and pregnant does get enough calcium in their diet. For example, I cannot get alfalfa hay, so I feed grass hay (orchard/fescue/timothy) and a grain that is high in calcium along with around equal parts alfalfa pellets. You just need to make sure the lactating or pregnant girls have a large source of calcium intake.Here's where the real frustration comes from. I've been feeding alfalfa hay free feed for my girls but I'm thinking of switching to grass (probably teft), but I've read that I have to be careful. I can throw off the calcium/phosphorus balance. So that's kinda where this started. I'm trying to figure out how to make sure I have the 1:1-1:2 ratio that goats need. I'm just unsure how to do that giving my situation (no pasture, feed store hay). So... I'll just have to give it a go and... watch for signs that they're unhappy.
Yeah, I look back at my first few years of photos with my NDs and my results weren't great. The cultural myths that goats can eat Bill Grogan's shirt and tin cans doesn't help. I keep trying and I'm getting better as I go. First few years I was buying small squares of really nice alfalfa mix horse hay. Now we have rough, weedy mixed hay from our out of control hay field. The goats love it and have never looked better.
I fluff their hay and they attack it like I was giving them fresh flakes. Fluff a few more times, then I throw it into the pen as bedding. Just working with what I have available.
Biggest feeding revelation for me is the minerals. I've tried them all and choose from what I can get based on highest amount of copper. I am diligent now on keeping them clean, fresh and always with clean fresh water. So my 2021 kidding season I had 2 quad births, 4 triplets, 3 twins and 1 single. Everyone is in great shape and milking well. I attribute all of that to my improved understanding of how important those minerals are.
And now thanks to readings on this forum, I am moving towards putting out individual minerals instead of buying a mix.
Keep paying attention and caring, you'll find your way.
I fluff their hay and they attack it like I was giving them fresh flakes. Fluff a few more times, then I throw it into the pen as bedding. Just working with what I have available.
Biggest feeding revelation for me is the minerals. I've tried them all and choose from what I can get based on highest amount of copper. I am diligent now on keeping them clean, fresh and always with clean fresh water. So my 2021 kidding season I had 2 quad births, 4 triplets, 3 twins and 1 single. Everyone is in great shape and milking well. I attribute all of that to my improved understanding of how important those minerals are.
And now thanks to readings on this forum, I am moving towards putting out individual minerals instead of buying a mix.
Keep paying attention and caring, you'll find your way.
Yea, that was last years realization. I'm still looking for the "best" way to offer the minerals... way as in feeder or container or whatnot. Most feeders get destroyed in a few weeks time. Especially in my ND Buck's pen. He's absolutely destructive to his feeders. I'm also getting serious about copper bolus and looking at BoSe injections in some rotation.Biggest feeding revelation for me is the minerals. I've tried them all and choose from what I can get based on highest amount of copper. I am diligent now on keeping them clean, fresh and always with clean fresh water. So my 2021 kidding season I had 2 quad births, 4 triplets, 3 twins and 1 single. Everyone is in great shape and milking well. I attribute all of that to my improved understanding of how important those minerals are.
Does he have some sort of toy? Something to keep him busy and maybe keep him from messing with his feeders?Especially in my ND Buck's pen. He's absolutely destructive to his feeders.
Not any more :/. He's more destructive than my Labrador who'll chew through a golf ball in 15 minutes...Does he have some sort of toy? Something to keep him busy and maybe keep him from messing with his feeders?
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
- This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
The Goat Spot Forum
A forum community dedicated to goat owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about breeding, health, behavior, housing, adopting, care, classifieds, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
Top Contributors this Month
View All
Boer Mama
668 Replies
GoofyGoat
460 Replies
Moers kiko boars
301 Replies
