Toxemia experience?

Discussion in 'Kidding Koral' started by MutantAtoms, Feb 16, 2013.

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  1. MutantAtoms

    MutantAtoms New Member

    16
    Jan 20, 2012
    SE Wyoming
    I'm new to goats as of a year ago, this will be my first batch of kids. I have raised all sorts of other animals, but goats seem to be a unique animal!

    Anyway...we have a Boer doe (Babs) that is currently 142 days pregnant. We noticed her laying down more about 1-2 weeks ago and groaning with breathign. At the time we chalked it up to her being the biggest of the 3 does that we had pregnant and she sounded like she was talking to her babies. In the last 3-4 days she has barely gotten up, though every time we check on her she is in a different position/place; hasn't touched her grain mix, and has barely drank water, and her breathing was up to 80/min.

    Once we realized she wasn't just going into labor we started doing a lot of fast reading....we started 2 days ago drenching her with "magic" (molases, corn oil, corn syrup) mixed with Tums, or probiotics, or a multivitamin (rotated through these) about 4 times/day. Yesterday we ended up taking her to the vet and he gave her 3 liters of IV fluids and an amp of glucose IV. Even though we are 2 days early for the 144 day mark of inducing...we did give her dexamathasone this morning about 9am. Her status this afternoon: she still hasn't drank much, and has only had a bite or two here and there, she is marginally more active (able to stand up and more resistance to our drenches), Her eyes are a little sunken looking, and I can still feel fetal movement. At about 4pm we gave her Calcium gluconate SQ "just in case".

    I am worried. I *think* she is slightly better, but not out of the woods. Has anyone had a goat get down this far and still survive to raise the kids? Is there something else I'm missing? Our thoughts at this point are to give 12 hours for the dex to start working and then give hormone to induce labor. We have a vet on standby to do a csection, but he isn't really a goat vet (PLEASE be nice...I'm trying to save a pet and if possible, her babies).
     
  2. HoosierShadow

    HoosierShadow Senior Member

    Apr 19, 2010
    Central Kentucky
    I have no experience with this, I am sorry. But I wanted to say that I hope and pray your doe will be okay, and her babies too.

    I never knew pregnancy toxemia was so common. I've been seeing it posted a lot on groups/forums. I am so sorry your having to deal with this. Hopefully she can deliver the kids on her own without needing a c-section.
     

  3. nancy d

    nancy d Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 5, 2007
    near Seattle
    Ask your vet for CMPK
     
  4. Tenacross

    Tenacross Well-Known Member

    May 26, 2011
    Enumclaw, Wa.
    If she's a pet and money is not a problem, C section might be the best route. I'd have to have faith in the vet though. Best outcomes I've heard of were with the doe standing. Whatever that entails.
    You've been trying. It should have helped.
    I'm worried she is dehydrated again. That's one reason why I like the "revive" recipe. You double it with warm water and they take it well in a drench. I've tubed sick adult goats with the revive and a pint of warm water too.

    edit. You are doing a lot of *right* things. You say she is somewhat better. She might be turning the corner. Keep her hydrated. Keep doing what you are doing. I hope those babies are mature enough to come a little early.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2013
  5. MutantAtoms

    MutantAtoms New Member

    16
    Jan 20, 2012
    SE Wyoming
    Of course after I post I find that thread...lol, thanks for pointing it out. I will have to look into some of the home CMPK mix. I'm quickly getting quite a home vet supply! Ah well...back to the barn...
     
  6. MutantAtoms

    MutantAtoms New Member

    16
    Jan 20, 2012
    SE Wyoming
    I hadn't run across the "revive" recipe but will give it a shot. We gave her estrumate late last night and she had a long drink by herself at that time. She is getting up and repositioning herself, but stands for no more than a few minutes. She does walk stiffly when she does walk, but the edema in her legs is less than it had been. We have been occaisionally giving her some water with the magic mixture. I think we are riding the fence on her status...she seems more down at my 5:30 check. We do plan to have her csectioned if she doesn't have them by tomorrow or if she gets worse. Thankfully I have today and tomorrow off to keep a close eye on her.

    Can you use a calf tube on a goat?

    Thanks for the advice! This is nervewracking!
     
  7. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    went through toxemia last year - she is at a fine time to induce (kids can survive at 142 days and be 100% healthy) -- have that done now. no need to C section her and chance loosing her when she is still strong enough to go through labor and delivery. You may need to manually dilate her so be ready to just gently work your finger in a circular motion around the cervix to dilate. Not all toxemia does need manual dilation but some do.

    also I second the CMPK - not sure why your vet didnt give calcium but I would!
     
  8. Tenacross

    Tenacross Well-Known Member

    May 26, 2011
    Enumclaw, Wa.
  9. Tenacross

    Tenacross Well-Known Member

    May 26, 2011
    Enumclaw, Wa.
    Mutant Atoms has said they gave injectable calcium. It's not like this doe isn't getting any sort of calcium therapy at all. They have also already initiated inducing labor.
     
  10. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    she gave one dose of calcium -- but Im second guessing the vet not giving it in the first place. I would be giving more calcium each day. Also she said she was going to Csection the doe before inducing. Yes Dex can induce but Ive tried it before with no results so I dont count on Dex being a good inducer she needs Lut
     
  11. Tenacross

    Tenacross Well-Known Member

    May 26, 2011
    Enumclaw, Wa.
    "Estrumate" is prostaglandin like lutalyse is. I agree she should not have a C section done unless the doe gets worse and is unable to have them on her own. If she seems to be in labor, but isn't properly dialating, I would for sure have a C section.
     
  12. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    wasnt familiar with estrumate - thanks for filling me in
     
  13. Frosty

    Frosty Active Member

    Feb 12, 2010
    Swanzey,NH
    Well I wish you luck and hope she kids for you and has a fairly easy time of it. You have been working real hard for her Keep up the good work and keep us posted
     
  14. LilBleatsFarm

    LilBleatsFarm Premier Colorado Nigerian Dwarf Breeder

    Jul 18, 2012
    Colorado
    how far away are you from FtCollins. If you don't feel good about your vet you could take her into the training hospital for CSU. Lots of good goat docs there.

    But you def don't want to stress her out at all. Was thinking SE Wyoming might be an hour drive or so from FtCollins. Are you close to Cheyenne?

    I'm almost in the same boat. I've got one doe who has given me trips and twins. Shes pretty big now and has 2 months to go. I left the barn door open when a cold front came through a few days ago and that set her off. Treated with Probios, VitB, NutriDrench for 3 days in a row. She's doin good now but now have a trouble child on my hands for a few months.
     
  15. MutantAtoms

    MutantAtoms New Member

    16
    Jan 20, 2012
    SE Wyoming
    Stacey...you are right, the Calcium was my idea. My normal goat vet is out of town...so the partner I saw gave me recommendations that I didn't follow...After the IV he said to just give her 1/2 cup of propolyne glycol daily and stop doing the molases drenches and come back if she didn't get better. He also did not want me to induce her for another week, but I weighed my options and all the advice I got (from reading articles online, another vet's advice, and the breeder I bought her from) and decided to start with 5cc/10mg of dex to start "detaching the condolydins and help mature the kid's lungs". I waited 12 hours before giving the Estrumate 1cc (9pm last night). I didn't have access to Lute, and the breeder prefers to use Estrumate over Lute for some reason...and so that's what I had...for better or worse.

    Back on the Calcium. I first tried to crush Tums and mix it in with the magic drench...but found that it clogged up the syringe I had. I found some other calcium supplements and made a royal mess in my kitchen crushing those. We have cattle, so when my husband got home we cracked out the Calcium gluconate and gave her 40mg last night and again at 5 this morning.

    Her status right now: She has only sipped water (maybe 1/2 cup?), eaten a handful of hay/grass, babies still moving inside, I don't notice any consistent contractions. She does stand up to turn around and go lay down in another spot without my prompting. Her leg swelling is down, but she still seems sore...more on her front legs. I'm not sure how to check the cervix?? I don't want to give her an infection...is it too soon to be checking that? How often should I be giving the calcium?

    LilBleats...I'm 70mi north-westish of Cheyenne. I was wondering...you said "trouble child on (your) hands for a few months"...did you have to do a lot with your doe after she kidded and showed signs of toxemia? Just wondering how long I will need to worry about her. lol

    Thanks everyone....
     
  16. crocee

    crocee New Member

    Jul 25, 2008
    Northeast Arkansas
    If you can still see the kids moving/kicking they haven't moved into position. If she does indeed start going into labor be prepared to go fishing for kids. Also be prepared for preemies since it doesn't sound like they're ready.
     
  17. MutantAtoms

    MutantAtoms New Member

    16
    Jan 20, 2012
    SE Wyoming
    Ok. 24 hrs after the Estrumate she now has whitish/clear discharge. Gonna be a LONG night I think. Any bets on when?
     
  18. Tenacross

    Tenacross Well-Known Member

    May 26, 2011
    Enumclaw, Wa.
    Good luck. I'm praying for you.
     
  19. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    how did things go? babies by now I hope