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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My Goal in June was to learn more about worms..to better care for my stock..In my quest to know more..Liver fluke fasinated me most..maybe because its not well known or talked about..this is one scary worm...A few months ago We lost a young ram...he seemed fine one day then that evening was down..took his temp and it was high..treated him for pueunomia...I remember his pee being very dark...and thought perhaps the B complex was the blame, his eye lids were also very pale...after reading the signs of Liver fluke I was shocked to see..red urine being the end sign if liver fluke infestation, the liver being distroyed...I want to share the article link on this very scary worm because I fear we will be seeing alot more cases..we all need to be in the Know and understand the signs..prevention and awareness is the key to survival....After we lost this little ram, everyone was treated with Ivomec plus..Ive not seen any more cases, but Im very watchful...best wishes

http://goat-link.com/content/view/152/#.UdJEzz6DTL9
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thats a good question nygoatmom...I would think it was less likely...not sure : )
 

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thanks for posting that article happybleats....I wonder if drylotted goats are as likely to get them?
Yes, absolutely, the flukes are on your hay.
The Midwest never had flukes until this drought and hay being shipped from the west. Your area already has wet flooded fields and the floods are only getting worse.
The disease isn't quite like the article says though. By the time they are getting that sick from flukes, they have had them for years. Red water disease is Tick Fever and has nothing to with Flukes. It comes from tick bites. We have that too, it rarely affects goats.
Where you are, it freezes well every year. Since it takes 4 months from the goat eating the encysted larvae to it reaching it's liver...prevention would be a dose of Ivo plus spring and fall.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
By the time they are getting that sick from flukes, they have had them for years
I have read that too in another article...Per tennesseemeatgoats
Over a long period of time anemia can slowly develop from liver fluke infection, but at nowhere near the level or speed that it occurs from the Barberpole stomach worm
but I have never read about Red water being a sign as well...I had that little lamb go down and had a real deep urine color,

Redwater is caused by a bacterium called Clostridium hemolyticum, which colonizes in the liver of susceptible cattle and produces protein toxins that in turn destroy the body's red blood cells, damages other organ systems and rapidly causes death. The migrating flukes damage local areas in the liver causing low oxygen tension and the bacteria prefer these conditions and begin to grow rapidly in these damaged areas. The disease has a short incubation period and the vast majority of affected goats are usually found dead and bloated
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This discibes what happened to my young ram perfectly...I had treated him..he was doing well, or seemed so, nibbling on hay,,drank some water,, then an hour later he was dead..and bloated....I know many things could cause this..it just curious....
There is always conflicking info..and perhaps speed of the kill speed of liver fluke has to do with the strength of the animal...I dont know lol Goat-link.com and Tennesseemeatgoats both are trusted sources, but dont always agree on things..so additional reading is always a good idea
 

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Yes, absolutely, the flukes are on your hay.
The Midwest never had flukes until this drought and hay being shipped from the west. Your area already has wet flooded fields and the floods are only getting worse.
The disease isn't quite like the article says though. By the time they are getting that sick from flukes, they have had them for years. Red water disease is Tick Fever and has nothing to with Flukes. It comes from tick bites. We have that too, it rarely affects goats.
Where you are, it freezes well every year. Since it takes 4 months from the goat eating the encysted larvae to it reaching it's liver...prevention would be a dose of Ivo plus spring and fall.
I take it Valbazen doesn't work on the flukes? Does a fecal show them?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Yes Valbazen does work on liver fluke....a regular fecal does not show them..a test called the braerman method is needed...
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Valbazen Drench

(Pfizer Animal Health) 11.36% Albendazole for removal and control of liver flukes, tapeworms, stomach worms (including 4th stage inhibited larvae of Ostertagia), intestinal worms and lungworms in cattle and sheep. For treatment of adult liver flukes in nonlactating goats. Do not use in the first 45 days of pregnancy.

Being it kill only the adult is the reason its recommended to do 3 times 10 days apart then once more in 30 days...to get all the stages..
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I think it would be a good idea if I learned to read page two on articles lol...
Goat-link.com discussion on Liverfluke does go to a page two and also discusses the slow process of liver fluke..apparently its the redwater disease she talks about happening quickly...but if I understand correct its after a long period of time dealing with Liver fluke...ugh..this can be confusing..lol...I recommend reading the entire article and decide for yourself how best to proceed in your herd...I have always used Ivomec plus in my goat herd or Valbazen...but I use ivomec for sheep in my sheep herd..which does not cover liver fluke..so I will be switching to valbazen for the sheep. ( I have tried Ivomec plus with them and the pain and agony for them was more than necessary....I have never seen a goat act like a sheep with Iv.+)
 

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This is a great article I have been wanting to learn more about liver flukes my self I am a little more concerned now though we have a ton of snails and slugs on our property I treat my goats with valzben and ivromectin (I really suck at spelling) it would cost me a fortune to to fecal test all the time and we have had a tough time with worms this yr with all the rain last yr I only needed to treat in early spring and late fall this yr it seems constant I have talk to several other people and they have had the same issue so I guess my question is what would you suggests as a good preventative program? I have a few girls still pregnant so I can't use the valzben on them
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I would choose Ivomec Plus...it cover liver fluke and a ton of other worms..best if used sub Q IMO..: )1 cc per 40# If there is a chance its heavy load...I would go a head and do the 3 x 10 days apart, then once more in 30 days...Ivomec plus is safe for Pregnant does..I like to booster the Ivomec plus before breeding and then valbazen after kidding..I think twice a year is more than enough unless I see anemia or unexplain unthriftines condition...It is suggested for areas with slugs and snails to booster before the summer and winter infection...so by doing before breeding then after kidding..should cover those two times..
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
here is something else I found...there is so much to read lol

Red Water can be caused by tick borne disease or liver fluke -
http://goat-link.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=152&Itemid=171

Actual Red Water Disease is usually not found in America:

Redwater
Sick animals

* There are two types of redwater, namely Asiatic redwater and African redwater
* Asiatic redwater is the more serious disease, although African redwater is probably more important as it is more widely spread. The signs are the same, although nervous signs also occur with Asiatic redwater
* Fever (40-41,5 degrees C)
* Pale to yellow eyes and gums
* Red-coloured urine
* With Asiatic redwater there could be nervous signs, with difficulty in walking and convulsions (can look like heartwater)
* Death
* Calves are resistant for the first 6 to 9 months of life

Dead animals

* Pale or yellowish carcass
* Blood thin and watery
* Large spleen
* Gallbladder large and filled with bile
* Red-coloured urine
* Brain pink in case of Asiatic redwater
 

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It's not found in America because the cattle producers went on a rampage and completely wiped out the ticks that carry it. This could be done in other countries as well.

Now as far as flukes go. I've found the twice a year dose of Ivo Plus to be pretty effective at keeping them under control.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Thanks Goathiker : ) I agree...twice a year is plenty..
 

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Wow, great thread, Cathy! I don't have time to read it all right now, but I will!! I hope this isn't the problem with my goats; I was going to call the vet today and ask if they test for all the worms...been busy, hadn't got to it yet, but I'm probably gonna go do it now. :)
 

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I would choose Ivomec Plus...it cover liver fluke and a ton of other worms..best if used sub Q IMO..: )1 cc per 40# If there is a chance its heavy load...I would go a head and do the 3 x 10 days apart, then once more in 30 days...Ivomec plus is safe for Pregnant does..I like to booster the Ivomec plus before breeding and then valbazen after kidding..I think twice a year is more than enough unless I see anemia or unexplain unthriftines condition...It is suggested for areas with slugs and snails to booster before the summer and winter infection...so by doing before breeding then after kidding..should cover those two times..
Great thx!!!
 
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