Very small Lamancha doeling

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by toomanychickens, Sep 5, 2017.

  1. toomanychickens

    toomanychickens New Member

    22
    Jun 3, 2016
    NW Georgia
    My 2 Lamancha doelings from 2 different farms. The little white one is (supposedly) 5 months old and the bigger one is 4 months old. The bigger one is 1/4 Nubian, but I dont think this accounts for the incredible size difference. I havent weighed the big one I assume she weighs 50+ pounds, but the little one only weighs 25# she has gained only 5#
    in the past month. So Im thinking that the little one is a mini goat and Ive been lied to...

    Unfortunately the pictures dont do justice to the size difference. The big doeling is new and wont come near me yet. blossom princess buttercup 2.jpg blossom princess buttercup.jpg blossom princess buttercup.jpg
     
    capracreek likes this.
  2. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Are you new to goats? I can see she is copper deficient from her fish tail. Did you have a fecal done to include coccidia? She may have never been treated for coccidia and is stunted.
     
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  3. toomanychickens

    toomanychickens New Member

    22
    Jun 3, 2016
    NW Georgia
    I havent had a fecal done, Ive kept an eye on her poop, it was clumped when she first came to us but is fine now. I have been using Mollys Herbal wormer for 2 months. Is she old enough to bolus? I was planning on doing it when she is 6 months old. She has access to minerals and she does eat them.
     
  4. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Good chance she is stunted from coccidia. Your sign is that she is small for her age.
     
  5. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    I agree
    Very small
    She most likely has cocci and worms, if you cannot get a fecal, treat her for both right away. But forst check her inner lower eyelid coloring if anemic, do not give Ivomec orally give it by SQ injection, 1 cc per 40 lbs every 10 days 3x. Start her on red cell, a horse product, if anemic. 6 cc per 100lbs orally for 1 week unless her color gets to Famancha chart borderline, then stop. If it continues to be too light, give 1 x a week thereafter until borderline, then stop.

    If her color is OK, give Ivomec cattle injectable orally, 1 cc per 33 lbs, every 10 days 3x.
    She does indeed have a fistail, copper deficiency.
     
  6. toomanychickens

    toomanychickens New Member

    22
    Jun 3, 2016
    NW Georgia
    Would she not have other symptoms of coccidia? Her poop has always been fine. I had noticed her tail, so the deficiency is decently new (at least to my eyes.) Her eyelids are a good dark pink. Is Ivomec going to treat the coccidiosis?
     
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  7. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Just being stunted can be the only sign. Ivomec will not take care of coccidia.
     
  8. Suzanne_Tyler

    Suzanne_Tyler GreenTGoats

    Jul 19, 2014
    US
    You can go ahead and give her copper bolus now. I usually start my kids on it when they're 3 months.
     
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  9. toomanychickens

    toomanychickens New Member

    22
    Jun 3, 2016
    NW Georgia
    I have a tube of Zimectrin Gold that I use for my dogs. I think Ill dose with that first, then when I can get to the Tractor Supply Ill get her the Albon. Thanks everyone for your help!
     
  10. toomanychickens

    toomanychickens New Member

    22
    Jun 3, 2016
    NW Georgia
    Thanks so much! Ive wanted to bolus them, but have been afraid to due to their age.
     
  11. toomanychickens

    toomanychickens New Member

    22
    Jun 3, 2016
    NW Georgia
    If she is stunted for whatever reason and isnt actually a mini, what are the chances she will recover and grow to full size? Will she be able to be bred to a full size buck? Ive already decided to not breed her until 2018
     
  12. ksalvagno

    ksalvagno Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    If you work on her now, especially for coccidia, you have a chance of her getting close to full size. But feed and supplements will be just as crucial as getting her parasite load down.
     
  13. toomanychickens

    toomanychickens New Member

    22
    Jun 3, 2016
    NW Georgia
    What supplements would you recommend? She has the best pasture ever, its mostly browse and over an acre, just the two of them. Ill do hay in winter. Also, they get a mixture of barley, wheat, oats, sunflower seeds, and alfalfa pellets twice daily. About a cup each. I also give them molasses along with their loose minerals.
     
  14. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    Make sure they get loose salt and minerals oil.
    With copper and selenium in it.

    Cocci has become very strange from years ago.
    We use to be able to tell by seeing runny dark, smelly poo. Some will get scours, some do not.
    Now, scours isn't the only sign and symptom. Even adults may start losing weight even though fed well or wormed. Goats are not always showing the classic scours now for some reason.
    Some kids just don't grow and may not show any poo issues.
    Cocci is awful, if left untreated kills(scars) the gut lining so the goat cannot absorb crucial nutrients to grow. So it stunts growth. She may never be of proper size if the damage is severe.

    Copper bolus is wise now, seeing the signs.

    A good protein grain like a 16% helps, plus to try to put weight on her, some calfmanna too. Always start out slowly, then gradually increase with any new feed.

    Worms can also stunt growth as well, but are treatable, after treatment then the goat will regain growth again.
    Getting a fecal will tell you for sure. Get it before treatment, if you can get back results quickly. If you can't get it back quickly, still get a fecal to see where the goat is at before any treatment, just take the sample in and start treatment anyway before the results, if they want to take a week or so to get it back to you.

    For certain worms, I give Ivomec cattle injectable orally at 1 cc per 33 lbs. Only if not anemic.
    If anemic, it is SQ (injected)1 cc per 40 lbs. Give again 10 days later either way. It is 3 x, 10 days apart.
    Wormer pastes, like horse products should be given 3 x the dosage for goats to work.

    If tape worms, it is Valbezen white wormer that kills them..

    To help her pick up more fortified vit B complex given SQ at 6 cc per 100 lbs is good daily for a little while. Also giving probiotics.
    But do know, if giving corid . Do not give any thiamine, which is in the fortified vit B complex until the full 5 day course is complete.

    Wormers do not kill cocci.
    But these do:
    Albon
    Corid
    DiMethox
     
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  15. mariarose

    mariarose Well-Known Member

    Albon I can only get from the vet.

    The only Dimethox I can get without the vet is to only be injected IV. That is the injection I never learned how to give.:(.

    I can still get Corid...

    Thank you for the reminder about Corid and Fortified B vitamins.

    Cocci is horrid.
     
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  16. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    Here is how to mix and give the powder form of corid if you need it.

    20% Powdered mixture: 3 ounces(10.5 tblspns) to 1 quart water
    Mixed solution well. Shake well before use.
    then dose it at ...
    30cc per 100lbs
    15cc per 50lbs
    7.5 per 25 lbs
    and so on
    treat individually for 5 days
     
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  17. mariarose

    mariarose Well-Known Member

    And Pam comes through again...
     
    toth boer goats likes this.
  18. nicolemackenzie

    nicolemackenzie Well-Known Member

    Dec 27, 2014
  19. toth boer goats

    toth boer goats Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Jul 20, 2008
    Corning California
    I was directed by my vet on how to mix and how much to give. So not familiar with that measurement from that webpage.
     
    mariarose likes this.