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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This thread is probably not really neccessary, as I intend to test soon anyway, but I was wondering how awful it would be if any of my goats did end up having CL or CAE.
If they show no syptoms of these diseases, and were to test positive, how does it affect them long term? Do the symptoms show up later, or do they just pass the genes on to their kids?
If one of my goats was to be positive, would I absolutely have to cull? I would hate to part with any of them:(, but I do very much want a clean herd.
 

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Some goats remain asymptomatic for their entire lives, and you would never know without testing. That doesn't mean they can't spread the disease to their offspring and herd mates though. It is not genetic, but CAE is spread through bodily fluids and CL from puss from an abscess. In the case of CL, the abscesses have to be cared for, but are not the end of the world. A goat with CAE often has chronic arthritis and other issues. If some goats were positive and some negative, you could separate them into two separate herds. The problem is, then it is difficult to sell any adults or kids from that point on. It is also difficult to control and can truly devastate a herd.

We only buy from negative herds, test annually, and raise all kids on a CAE prev. program from birth. I think a little prevention really does go a long way.

I am not sure what I would do if I had a goat come back positive. I love them all, so I might just stop buying, selling, and breeding completely. Let my little herd live out their lives and enjoy the time I have with these amazing little creatures called goats.
 

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IMHO, how you handle a positive is TOTALLY up to you. I am very reluctant to cull any goat, for two reasons: first, because of emotional attachment; and second, because of genetic diversity. The narrower the gene pool, the less robust the breed becomes. Of course, if the goat has a low quality of life or was very likely to infect other goats, I would cull.
But to others, having a clean herd is very important, and they would cull any positive even if it didn't show symptoms.

There are ways to "manage" diseases, meaning while you don't have a 100% clean herd, the numbers of positives are steadily going down, and your herd will eventually be clean. With CAE, you would not ever let a kid suckle off a positive doe. (Does will sometimes suck a little off each other too, so it would be a good idea to keep positives separate for that reason.) With CL, you would quarantine any goat with an abscess, and vaccinate all negatives. With Johne's, you would graze all kids on clean pastures. With all of them, you would give them a healthy diet and stress-free life so they could fight off the disease as well as possible. And any time a goat showed signs of succumbing to any of these diseases, you would cull.

But no matter where in the spectrum you fall, you should be honest to potential buyers. You don't do the goat world any favors by sweeping the truth under a rug. :)

But most of all, here's hoping you have negative results! :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Oh I would never sell a goat to someone without telling them the whole story. I think I would probably cull if we had any that were positive, but I don't know for sure. It would depend on which one it was! I thought that CL was something that they would have forever once they get it; can it be cured?
 

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I thought that CL was something that they would have forever once they get it; can it be cured?
No. Once a goat has CL, they have it for the rest of their lives. Depending on how the abscess was handled, they could very well never develop another one, but they still have CL.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
That's too bad. :( I wish someone would come up with a cure!

OakHollow, I was wondering: why would you need to raise your kids on a CAE prevention program of the dams are all negative? I'm just curious.
 

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That's too bad. :( I wish someone would come up with a cure!

OakHollow, I was wondering: why would you need to raise your kids on a CAE prevention program of the dams are all negative? I'm just curious.
Just as prevention and to give new owners peace of mind. We do travel to several shows throughout the year where they could pick up a disease, and we only test anually. Plus, false negatives are always a possibility. It is better to be safe than sorry in my opinion, plus it results in friendlier kids and is the "standard" for most dairy herds around here. :)
 

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I just shared on another thread on this...I didnt test for a long time..I didnt trust the false neg/pos. thing lol..as stated on fiasco farms..but more and more are wanted proof of CAE negative on parents of the kids I sell so we tested..I was shocked to find four of my girls were Positive. They had no health issues..they were well conditioned, shiny coats, no swollen knees and were not getting sick all the time...My heart sank deep...I couldnt sleep for days..what was I to do..these are not just goats to me...but precious parts of our lives....I looked for a pet home for them...adveritsed for them to go to a pet/companion home..Many who own horses look for goats to keep with them as companions...some just want them to tax purposes or to keep a field trimmed..so I set out to find a good home..I got lucky..or I should say blessed...got a call from a lady who didnt have any goats..understood what CAE was and how to handle the kidding..she came and took all of them home...she keeps me updated on them and they are doing great...there is a strong chance they will never show any signs of the disease..and give her many years of pleasure...Looking out and knowing the goats that remain are negative is a good feeling, that not knowing shadow can become a burden...and as I shared before..not knowing does not change the fact they are Positive..it just risks the health of the herd and kids born here...
 

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There are CAE positive herds. They can get top blood ines for dirt cheap if they are CAE Pos. they have very careful breeding snd kidding practices and can be quite successfull on raising kids CAE negative...finding them can be hard..most dont advertise. I found out that the mom of two of my postive does was found to be Positive and sold to one of these ranches..They are just like us..caring goat lovers but willing to work with the disease to keep good milking lines alive..
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks for sharing Cathy.I saw a bit of the other thread, that what got me thinking about it, so I started this one.
I totally appreciate people caring for animals that are positive, I think that great, but I don't know if I would want to do that. It just seems like it would be simpler to have a clean herd.
 

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Much easier with a clean herd. If I had seperate property I wouldnt mind helping keep good blood lines alive, selling CAE negative kids from top lines can be profitable as well..but its a huge amount of work and too risky to have two herds on one property ...
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Just one other question here: would you say that CAE and CL are the most important diseases to test for, or would it be good to do some others as well?
 

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CAE, CL And Johns disease are what most test for...and Nubian owner test for G6S ...however I dont test for CL...I feel if they get a cyst then I will deal with it..to me its something you can deal with and is only contagious in the puss....thankfully I have not had to deal with it for a very long time..it is a pain..heres my reasoning..wrong or right lol...if I buy a goat and she happens to have been exposed to CL..her body builds a defence against it and she never presents a cyst..I test her and she comes back positive for CL....but never had cl...she may have a strong immune system that is a good thng to pass on to offspring...do you cull or keep? I rather deal with it if I see it..I have friends who put down a goat tested positive with no sign of Cl any where..heart breaking..and IMO unnecessary...If we would as a whole be responsable and treat CL with the caution that is needed we can perhaps get ahead of it... Full discloser and understanding of the disease is what helps stop the spread..and yes..there are repeat offenders that become unthrifty and a threat...that is when putting one down is best..IMHO;)
 

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Test for Johne's.
 

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Through your vet and, usually, the state lab. I think my vet has a couple of different labs they use, but don't quote me on that. I would test for CAE and Johnes. I don't test for CL, but I already know I have that so there is no point. I also don't test for Brucellosis because that in an abortion disease, my herd is closed, and I don't have pasture so the chances of it coming in are slim to none. If they were running on pasture, I would test for it because we have a high number of deer. I am actually a little surprised that Brucellosis is not a required vaccination for goats. I suspect it will be before too long.
 

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WADDL will test for Brucellosis with the same blood you send for the other testing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I'll have to ask the vet about it next time we go; I once called and asked about testing foe CAE and CL, but the girl on the phone didn't have any idea what I was talking about. I'm kind of surprised she didn't just ask the vet at the time.. She usually will go ask him when I call about something she can't help me with.. I'll just talk to the vet directly next time. :)
 
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