White Scours in 2-Week-Olds - Update: Both Died

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by kornhypknotic, Mar 29, 2010.

  1. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    I no longer live at the goat farm, but I have to visit the girls regularly :love:

    Last night I checked on the babies and two siblings :kidblue: :kidred: who are very special to me have incredibly foul smelling white scours! They were so weak this morning that the doeling could barely stand. I told the person in charge of livestock to give them 0.5cc Banamine for their stomach cramping, 1cc Pepto Bismol, and to switch them to pure oral electrolytes (no milk) and to disinfect the nipples and bottles very well. I got this protocol from a vet who treated two baby goats from 3 weeks ago with this same problem. The vet did not diagnose the condition but offered some phone-consultation . . . the babies were 1 week older than these two and they recovered fully after 3 days.

    There has been some confusion among the volunteers and I guess the milk pails have not been disinfected for weeks. I assume that to be the cause of transmission.

    Does anyone have any other ideas as to what type of bacteria would cause white and terrible smelling scours? And what should be done to treat these babies? :whatgoat:
     
  2. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    coccidia comes to mind -- that is very fowl smelling. Also ecoli will cause white scours.

    They will need a cocci medication or oral neomycin for the ecoli
     

  3. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    I did not find any parasites on their fecal exam. That's why I'm so confused because I would think coccidia first. :shrug:
     
  4. AlaskaBoers

    AlaskaBoers New Member

    May 6, 2008
    Wasilla Alaska
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    would ecoli show up?

    sounds like you did good getting them set-up, this is why cleanliness is key :)
     
  5. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    The new person in charge of livestock said that she was at her wits end and that she was just going to let it run its course because she couldn't figure it out. I refuse to let "just run its course" be the answer when these kids are that weak.

    I can do a grams stained fecal smear tomorrow to see if they have any bacteria in their feces.
     
  6. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    ecoli is the most likely

    Neomycin oral solution is easy to come by at like Tractor supply.
     
  7. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    Oral solution!? :stars: I can only find it mixed in milk replacer :GAAH:
     
  8. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    yah the oral solution -- if you cant find it then you can give antibiotic shots but I figured orally is always easier with kids
     
  9. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    :tears: The little female died last night :kidred: . I took her in to school yesterday and gave her 200ml SQ fluids and dextrose which made her seem so much better! She drank an entire bottle and a half of electrolytes from the current livestock intern last evening but sometime during the night she passed away and just never woke up.

    Her brother has had this problem for about 11 days now. I gave him the same amount of fluids today and he drank a bottle of electrolytes this morning. He is still very weak and very sad without his baby sister :tears:
     
  10. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    I'd give him a shot of Excenel. You need something that is going to work and work fast. You will need to get it from your vet.
     
  11. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    What is Excenel? Antibiotic?
     
  12. RunAround

    RunAround New Member

    Feb 17, 2008
    Massachusetts
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    Yes
     
  13. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    is it expensive? =/
     
  14. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    yes but worth it

    if you cant get Excenel try any oxytetracyline (LA 200, Biomycin, Duramycin etc)
     
  15. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    If it's expensive the farm will never go for it. I'll figure out a dose for the LA200.

    I almost feel like it's Karma or something. Their mom had to be shot a week ago because the farm refused to let me treat her adequately for chronic mastitis due to it being breeding season and they 'needed' a doe from her this season to replenish the does of the herd. Once she kidded her udder was so badly scarred and damaged that she would never be able to be a milking doe. They were happy that they at least got a doeling out of her before she had to be put down. Now that baby girl is gone too and the buckling may pass on as well. All because of complete lack of milk pail and nipple sanitation which would never have been a problem for the babies if they still had their momma. Their shortsightedness and thriftiness cost them two healthy, productive does and possibly her wether as well (and even if he does live he will be culled in a year for meat anyway).

    Sorry for the rant. I've been up all night thinking about it and stewing in my anger and in how unfair the whole situation is. Had to get it off my chest.
     
  16. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    well I think you should say something -- because you are absolutely right.

    its like "a stitch in time saves nine" do something now and you will save time money and goats later

    Its horrible when people wont even try
     
  17. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    They even refused to let me treat her appropriately. I was willing to spend the time and energy (even my own limited funds) to treat her because I knew that I could make her better. But they wanted her bred on schedule and that was obviously more important to them than her health and longevity. It cost them everything.

    I've practically been preaching the "stitch in time saves nine" philosophy all along. I even got chewed out a few times by my boss because he would get upset when I explained why diseases were happening (that it was our fault, not the goat's). :hair:

    Anyway, I've left the farm. Moved off. Couldn't take it anymore. I'm done with the higher-ups. The new livestock intern is awesome and she tries her best to do what's right for the animals so I'm only working with her now. Better to ask forgiveness than permission when in this situation and dealing with animal health. "Oops! Sorry! I just saved your goat! Probably should have asked you if it was ok first." lol :p

    I can support her too when she goes through the same issues with the people in charge.
     
  18. StaceyRosado

    StaceyRosado Administrator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Oct 4, 2007
    NJ
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    well hopefully they will realize it isnt a good business practice to just let goats die. Or get out of the goat business all together
     
  19. kornhypknotic

    kornhypknotic New Member

    273
    May 14, 2009
    Waco, TX
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    I hope so too. I couldn't even get them to take CAE seriously :doh:. In the end (again, long-term thinking) I think they will be forced to get out of the goat business because they will not make money with the way they are managing their herd now. Unless something drastic happens and they realize what they are doing I think their dairy is ultimately doomed. It's very sad.
     
  20. farmergal

    farmergal New Member

    519
    Jun 19, 2009
    Northern California
    Re: White Scours in 2-Week-Olds

    That sounds so awful and I'm sorry about the loss of the mom and doeling. You'd think that would get them to wake up... But, I'm glad you were there at least to help the little ones as much as possible. And it's good you got out of that situation, it would be way too frustrating to have to deal with people like that.